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The Great Health Mystery
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Post by
Pezwar
Armory
Ok, now that that's out of the way, here's my...story. This is my second 80. He's an alt. I tank heroics and Naxx when I'm bored on this guy so he's not exactly in the best of gear. Mainly Naxx - Ulduar 10 drops and a few emblem pieces. My spec is probably a little out dated, but again, it's an alt. I'm just above 30k health unbuffed, which I'm pretty happy with. Granted, it's nothing compared to the 37-40k tanks of today.
Anyways. I logged on today to talk to some buddies in the guild. We decided to do an alt CoS. We brought in a Shammy and a Mage who both dinged 80 within the past three days, and an alt mage that's still in greens that is never used. We pugged the last dps (Shammy was Resto) and we got a Boomkin. We're going through CoS and we have no intention of trying timed because dps was kinda low and the Healer wasn't sure he could do it. The boomkin was aware of this.
As we get to the Inn, he starts telling us all to hurry it up so we could make the time, etc...Well, Long story short, we make it to the boss, pull him, get him down to ~15k, and then he goes through the portal because we ran out of time. No big deal. No one, except the boomkin cared, and he knew we didn't plan on doing it anyways.
After we down Mal'Ganis, he needs on all the loot, (and sadly wins both the
ring
and
shoulders
that the mages rolled on also) then he ragequits the group. He then begins to whisper me about how much I sucked and was a terrible tank because I only had 30k health.
This got me to thinking...In BC and Vanilla, did peoples expectations of toons grow even larger the further into the content the story got? I mean really, I started tanking heroics on this guy before Ulduar was even released. I remember starting out with roughly 23k health and working my way up to where I am now. I know, without a doubt, that I'm more than capable of tanking heroics and that this boomkin was just upset, but seriously? Is it normal for people to expect 35k health tanks anymore? That's just ridiculous.
TL;DR - Is the expectation that every tank HAS to have 35k health reasonable for pugs to have in a heroic? And was it like this in BC?
Post by
Aris
I dont see an issue with a boomkin rolling need on caster loot in a 5man heroic. With my resto shaman alt, i roll need on cloth and leather all the time. Unless your tanking or doing PVP, the armor class really has no value what so ever.
As far as tanks not having enough health. I'll tell you right now, for everyone who does not tank that's the only stat they all look at. Its always been like that. It was the same back in BC when i was tanking with my prot warrior. Health = Skill for people who don't play tanks.
Since i actually have tanked, with 3 of the 4 tanking classes now, at end game content, i look at more than just health. But i am the minority. IMO, the only thing i care about in a tank is if he holds aggro and has good enough gear for the content to be survivable. If your not undergeared for the content, and you never lose aggro, you are a great tank IMO.
Post by
Pezwar
I dont see an issue with a boomkin rolling need on caster loot in a 5man heroic. With my resto shaman alt, i roll need on cloth and leather all the time. Unless your tanking or doing PVP, the armor class really has no value what so ever.
=( my bad. I'm not gonna name drop him and link his armory, but he's a 25-man Ulduar geared boomkin. He had absolutely no reason to roll on anything that dropped and he was just there for emblems. Sorry I didn't state that earlier.
He was bad. DPS wise, he was good, doing 4.5kish on bosses when he popped all CD's, but he was also captain of the @#$%^&ball team =/
Post by
138583
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Post by
Holyfrequis
Tanking is about doing tps and staying alive. If you did both i dont see how you having 5k more can make you better tank or how lacking 5k hp makes you bad tank.
Boomkin was a retard.
I agree, My DK has 28k unbuffed health.
But what people tend to forget is there are many types of tanks.
Main tanks, main off tanks, add tanks, mitigation tanks
I may have 28k health but i also have mitigation which makes bosses miss attacks
people only look at your health when they see that you dont have a "MT" health pool they think your undergeared or suck because they dont understand the mechanics of tanking and survivability
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341986
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146010
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345177
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421511
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Post by
MegaVolt
It's gotten much worse recently though, with the emblem "welfare epics" and of course, those Brewfest trinkets, now anybody willing to grind for a few nights can have a 35k tank.
Not really. I just started tanking with my DK and even with both brewfest trinkets and most of the "welfare epics" I am still sitting at barely 30k unbuffed (as frost tank). There are quite a few pieces that you can't get with emblems and having a few ilvl 187 blue items left seriously hurts my health pool.
But then again 30k hp and def cap on their own are more then enough to easily tank any heroic so I don't really worry about it.
Post by
295421
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Post by
cxnecroxc
40k+ Health
5%Dodge
5%Parry
5% Miss
(base stats b4 def)
0 Def
is pro compared to
30k HP
15-25%dodge
15-25% parry
10.6% miss(5% base 5.6% from bonus 140 def skill)
1st is clear winner!(Sarcasm :P)
Post by
iDelorean
It's only an expectation from idiots that have never worked hard for anything in their life, which you may have noticed that there has been a recent increase in. They think they leet just because they got their 25man Helmet and Chest from the vendor, jacked their gems from the GB, and also jacked the mats from the GB for their enchants.
What the hell does a drood need with an epic flyer anyway....? <_<
Post by
Raleandris
Perhaps not the drake, but the extra badge he drops, if he was there just to farm badges.
Post by
hashmel
when wotlk was fresh tanks were diving into heroics with ~22k and getting the job done, those that refuse to go with anything less than an uld geared tank are just lazy dolts who'd rather not put forth much effort themselves and rely on someone else to do the bulk of the work for them
as for the mount druids like everyone else enjoy having some variety and are just as entitled to a mount they'll ride ~2% of the time as anyone else who'll ride it ~2% of the time
pallies, locks, and DKs all have class mounts but do they refrain from collecting more? no, they in fact are largely the antagonists insisting they deserve them but that's for another thread to run circles around.
Post by
Hashshashins
What the hell does a drood need with an epic flyer anyway....? <_<
He also could be going for the 50/100 mount achievements, I know I have it on my own druid (the mount that is, am still going for the achievement), but yeah going for the extra badge is something that I always try to do, I tend to look at it this way, if you get it done fast enough, you'll get a free badge as a reward :D
Anyways I'd just note who that moonkin is and do some sort of blacklisting of him within your guild, if that is how he wants to behave let him imo but don't let his childishness ruin the game for others, we all pay to play and that means we want to have fun.
As for him needing on the loot, he is allowed to need if he wants but only if he needed the upgrades but judging by your claim that he is ulduar geared then he clearly doesn't need the gear. In all, just ignore him and move onwards, it's what I tend to do when I come across players like that
Post by
Bllets
I've got 38666 hp unbuffed and heroics is a damn joke, healers find it boring to heal and it's just tedious to do for both of us.
You need like 22-25k unbuffed to do heroics, and the healer doesn't even need to be epic geared to do it.
People are just getting used to be carried by good healers and/or tanks, and it's getting really pathetic these days.
Specially when it comes from a druid which seems to be pretty bad geared.
This reminds i once got declined to a heroic because i only had ~34k health unbuffed.
Post by
188262
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Hashshashins
When did dps ever understand anything besides the numbers on recount? This druid was a prime example, he hurries the group yet i doubt he took into consideration the healer's regen for example, or the fact that maybe the mage might have to sit for a minute to drink etc.....tis a sad state of affairs in WoW these days, this is one of the reasons I avoid pugging, always try to get guildies, atleast then I know that everyone has half a clue, no matter what their gear is like.
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