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Help from rets better than I.
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Post by
89501
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Post by
Quest
Using the wrong seal. I submit to you a better one;
http://www.wowhead.com/?forums&topic=90113&p=984027
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89501
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179128
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89501
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147614
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343682
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351669
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Post by
Dravyck
munkles you might as well not post stuff like this here, there are way too many retards on these forums now. Even the vets are getting flamed for correcting people now (see above). If people would stop, for just one second, and read the post instead of insta-replying with regurgitated elitistjerks posts which they really know nothing about, perhaps a very serious discussion could take place. But, like I said, people are just way too ignorant.
Post by
89501
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Post by
svirve
The actual damage from the SoC is both affected and not. The fact that it deals holy damage makes it not directly affected by ArP but since your other strikes are affected by ArP the SoC damage will be indirectly increased in damage.
CS is subject to ArP.
You need 15.39 ArP to gain 1% of ignored armor when striking.
I would say that on bosses with very high amounts of armor, stacking ArP and using SoC can come out on top.
Bosses with low armor, SoB is your king!
Post by
89501
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Post by
svirve
Yea that's pretty much what im saying :)
Post by
179128
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89501
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Post by
svirve
that SV did!
Ooh you make it all tingly in my stomache munkles!
On topic:
Im gonna try and do some math on the effects of ArP on SoC and try to approximate how much is needed after i've figured out the mystery of the missing dodge% with quest.
Post by
daboss40
Ok. I'm not a huge theorycrafter, but I'll try to provide some logical commentary for ya.
this is my retadin, as you can see im not in the best of the best gear, but i push out over 2.5k dps in 5 man pugs.
Any decent ret will pull 3.5k+ with that gear, and you've stacked hit way too high.
Not quite. You'd need to have a pretty amazing set of buffs, and a situationally beneficial fight to pull off 3.5k dps with 3k ap. That being said, 2.5k dps seems a touch low. In a 10-man maybe?
HIT
STR
EXP
CRIT
AGI
HASTE
AMOR PEN
AP
Thanks for your input, but your preaching to a big ass choir if you think you taught munkles anything with this.
armor pen is virtualy useless cus ret pallys do holy damage
Wow.
Sure he was wrong, but you weren't right in saying 'Wow' either. Fact is, some of a ret pala's damage is holy. Come to think of it, very large amount of it is holy in raid AoE settings like naxx.
mrmunkles brings up a great point. Will stacking armor pen help us? Of course. but we need to see the bigger picture. Blizz itemizes gear in such a way that stacking one will inevitably reduce the stats on others.
As it stands, our melee, CS, and DS will benefit from Armor pen, as those are our only physical attacks. These do not not form the majority of our damage. By contrast, virtually all of a warriors damage is physical, so he/she will be much more inclined to pick up armor pen then we are. So the $64,000 question is: Do we give up on strength and hit in order to stack a stat that will only affect 50% of our damage in the best case scenario? I wouldn't.
1) Is the proc on SoComm affected at all by ArP? Nope.
2) Is crusader strike affected at all by ArP? Yes.
3) What affect would one expect to see from 561 ArP? Lots, but not nearly as much as if you had 561 strength.
Hope this helps.
Post by
89501
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Post by
svirve
Doing some testing on the Heroic Training Dummy with SoC now to establish it's behaviour to make it easier to consider the effects of ArP. This is pretty much general information but putting it here so we got the full behaviour of SoC.
SoC can...
be dodged/parried (subject to expertise) or blocked
miss (subject to hit cap)
crit (for 2x damage)
SoC ignores weapon skills, i had ~320 weapon skill and was getting full damage SoC hits while my white hits were hitting for ~50.
This seems to strengthen the fact that its damage is based on your weapon damage and not damage done.
Damage formula:
{0.45*min+0.45*0.23*SP} to {0.45*MAX+0.45*0.23*SP}
min and MAX being weapon damage.
It doesn't scale with ArP like DaBoss said.
Not even indirectly as i first suggested.
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