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Inherently Evil
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Post by
330654
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Post by
ASHelmy
I agree with Laihendi. Word of mouth used as a communication medium does not necessarily make the information passed on true. Example, if you lived in a tiny medievil village, and everyone around you said the world was flat, and that any other possibility was outrageous and those who spoke out against the masses would be punished by being burnt at the stake.... I'm pretty damn sure you would be standing on a podium screaming at anyone who would listen that the world is flat.
Also, to say that the Quran was written by one man who was apparently uneducated and illiterate takes far more faith to believe than to believe its a good old smoke and mirror show. It may have had others contributing to it, editing it, perhaps even scribes writing down what he said. I'm not saying what it contains is wrong, for that is for the individual to decide, personally I'm an agnostic.
And finally, a lack of education and ignorance in general does lead to people following schemes/lies etc. i.e. all those people caught up in "You have won $10,000 in a random lotto draw, that you didn't even enter! Just send us your credit card details to collect!".
I am actually fairly sure that no one edited it, there were scribes the wrote exactly what he said. the qu'ran was sent down to the prophet over many years, he didn't just come out one day and said that he has the full qu'ran. You would also be surprised as to how well his whole life (particularly after he became the prophet, naturally) was documented.
Post by
134465
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GoGoGodzilla
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184848
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345586
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307081
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74218
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184848
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Post by
Skyfire
Ok well there are way too many posts I want to quote so i'll just say it all at once here. Firstly, let me talk about a creator. In my honest opinion it takes more faith for someone to be aethist rather than believing in God. To me its obvious and can be proven with just the fact that were are living in
creation
. Look at a car for example. Lets say you own a wrangler. Who made it? Jeep. Thats how you know it is there because it was created. If I were to tell you that your car evolved into a perfect vehicle over millions of years, it wouldnt make sense. Same goes for a watch. If I were to throw a bunch of scrap metal, gears and what not into a dryer, should I expect a Rolex to pop out a million years later? Absolutely not. I was once told that billions of years ago there was piece of metal on some desolate planet. After millions of years this metal formed into the shape of a can. Then a few million years later there formed in the can a sweet tasting liquid. Then later on the side of the can evolved the writing "Pepsi 12fl oz". That story sounds ridiculous and lacks any form of logic. If you look at a banana it peels open perfectly for eating, contains vitamins that are essential. If its green its too early, brown too late, yellow just right. It even fits just right into your hand. All the signs of creation. Why should I expect the human body, which a single eye contains more functional parts than a car to be evolved rather than created? Creation is proof of a creator.
One, you're presupposing that they had to be created in the parts and pieces that you suggest they did. Evolution doesn't work like that; it's a
gradual
change. It's like saying humans don't have a tail because we said we didn't want to have a tail, when in fact the tail became vestigial in humans because we had no more need for it. And it has gradually gone away.
Alternatively, what you're saying is that the LEGO set came with certain sets of pieces already composed, when in fact LEGO sets are not in any way shape or form pre-assembled. You have to build them yourself from one piece (but the building material is still there). And without the instruction manual, you'd have no idea how. You
don't
just throw in 2 legs, 2 arms, a pair of eyes and hundreds of organs in a washing machine and expect for anything to come out.
Creation is
not
proof of a creator. That would presume that life was created with the intent that it should fill a purpose, when in fact it was not (excepting plain survival).
You should read
this article
. It explains why your reasoning is faulty in better depth than I can.
And you're further confusing something which is absolutely inorganic, with something that is. We're not talking about cans of metal, because we know that metal can't evolve, because it can't become living.
I read a couple of posts about the Bible being mistranslated over the years.
I don't think
anyone
here argued that the Bible was mistranslated. Only that the stories within the Bible have been changed (maliciously or not) to manipulate the people who read it without considering that it can be or is wrong.
Also on a similar note, if you look at what science said at the time the old testament was written, then look at what the bible said at the time, THEN look at what science says now, you will see that science is finally starting to agree with the bible. The bible stated that there were inumerable stars, caverns and canyons at the bottom of the ocean, that light travels, blood is an essential source of life, etc. Science then disagreed yet the Bible was correct, am I wrong? If you would like to debate that I could go on much longer, but my post is getting too long as it is. But dont try to prove the Bible wrong. People have been trying for thousands of years and have all failed.
Blood is
not
an essential source of life. Light doesn't "travel", as it exists in all reference frames. The number of stars
are
numerable, and we can even calculate when all the stars will cease to exist, because while matter and energy are finite, there is entropy, which says that the energy in the stars will cease to exist in that form at some point, because the chaos of the universe is always increasing. The Bible is decidedly wrong. You either do not know these things because you haven't learned them or because you choose not to believe them.
Lastly I must say this. Islam and Christianity are NOT the same thing.
No, I argued that they have the same goals, and that is to be morally
good
. The manner of the way you get to that goal is different between the two books, but the overall goal is that. And it is by definition a religion.
Post by
MyTie
Skyfire, the Bible has been mistranslated before. Some translations, although extremely minor, do have different meanings. Usually this is benign, but it technically constitutes mistranslation.
Also you said "Creation is not proof of a creator". Could you please elaborate this sentence. I want to give you that oportunity, at least, before I punt it back into the bad idea box where it belongs.
Post by
307081
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Post by
MyTie
Blood is
not
an essential source of life. Light doesn't "travel", as it exists in all reference frames. The number of stars
are
numerable, and we can even calculate when all the stars will cease to exist, because while matter and energy are finite, there is entropy, which says that the energy in the stars will cease to exist in that form at some point, because the chaos of the universe is always increasing. The Bible is decidedly wrong. You either do not know these things because you haven't learned them or because you choose not to believe them.
Light does travel. It takes 7? minutes to get to earth from the sun. Also it has mass, since it is affected by the gravity wells of black holes.
The number of stars might be innumerable when taken into account multiple universes. By this estimate though, everything is innumerable. And somewhere, out there, you, Skyfire, not only are a little more open minded, but I like you, maybe.
The energy in the stars may continue to exist in that form again, in another star.
None of this disproves the Bible.
You either do not know these things because you are to closed minded to see all the options, or because you choose not to believe them. Either way, you
might
be wrong. That's all I'm saying.
Post by
266586
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Post by
MyTie
It is about 8.3 minutes. So you were right. (More or less.)
Thanks. I couldn't remember the exact time.
Post by
74218
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Post by
MyTie
lasers that shoot out bacon.
That one is going straight to my Santa's Wish List.
Post by
331344
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Post by
MyTie
atemushadows - Very close. You got lost when you said "energy has mass if it were to drop below the speed of light". It would be more accurate to say that "energy is mass", sort of.
Post by
331344
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