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Post by
ElhonnaDS
I still don't get why people care about the numbers so much.
Because they want to be proven right. If they see Blizzard either lose subs, or gain them (depending on which they feel SHOULD happen), it makes them feel validated in their opinions about what is right or wrong with the game.
Post by
Adamsm
Define 'so much'. I think people care, because they care about the game.Yet the sub number has nothing at all to do with the game itself; I could care less if there are 10 mil players or only 10, as long as I can play the game. People can whine, !@#$% and moan all they want; but really, quit the game and go be 'happier'.
I still don't get why people care about the numbers so much.
Because they want to be proven right. If they see Blizzard either lose subs, or gain them (depending on which they feel SHOULD happen), it makes them feel validated in their opinions about what is right or wrong with the game.
I suppose...still moronic though.
Post by
Eccentrica
I still don't get why people care about the numbers so much.
Because they want to be proven right. If they see Blizzard either lose subs, or gain them (depending on which they feel SHOULD happen), it makes them feel validated in their opinions about what is right or wrong with the game.
Additionally, players are concerned about the health of the game I think. We want to leave when we are finished with it, not have the lights turned out prematurely (for us) because a critical mass has been reached.
Post by
lankybrit
Define 'so much'. I think people care, because they care about the game.Yet the sub number has nothing at all to do with the game itself; I could care less if there are 10 mil players or only 10, as long as I can play the game. People can whine, !@#$% and moan all they want; but really, quit the game and go be 'happier'.
I seriously doubt you'd be happy if Blizzard suddenly only had 10 subs. How would you get your precious feeling of the world being alive with CRZ if only 10 people played? :)
But seriously, the game would be in a horrible shape and the writing would be on the wall. Wouldn't you like to know that?
What Eccentica said: We care about the Health of the game. Yes, it's the same game with 9M or 10M subs, but knowing the direction the game is taking and what Blizzard are likely doing about it is interesting.
Cheers.
Post by
Adamsm
And yet...they rarely if ever say why the numbers are what they are; all they tell you is that is what the in game population is, not what has changed or what is altered. So basing the 'health' of the game on subs is still stupid.
Think of how many MMO's are still going that aren't at Blizzard's numbers, yet they seem to survive alright.
And I really wouldn't care one way or another how many subs were around as long as I could play the game.
Post by
Rankkor
I still don't get why people care about the numbers so much.
Because they want to be proven right. If they see Blizzard either lose subs, or gain them (depending on which they feel SHOULD happen), it makes them feel validated in their opinions about what is right or wrong with the game.
Isn't it a little sad that they need to feel validated in that particular way to be proven right?
If wow just lost 1 million players, its not proof that OMG IT S GONNA DIE, just as if it gains another million its not proof that SEE? ITS HERE FOREVER SUCKERS!.
Players come and go in waves, they play, they get burned out, they leave, then they come back. This is how every MMO works. None but the most dedicated have played non-stop every day of every week, of every month, of every year.
Post by
voodoopimp
Additionally, players are concerned about the health of the game I think. We want to leave when we are finished with it, not have the lights turned out prematurely (for us) because a critical mass has been reached.
This, so much. I couldn't care less about being "right," but the more subscriptions there are, the more money Blizzard makes and the more new content and improvements they can put out.
inb4 conspiracy theories about how Blizzard spends their money
Post by
320750
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Adamsm
quarterly performance will determine whether Blizzard stays the course or pivots to change directionI think Cata shows that's not exactly true.
As for CRZ, I doubt it's going anywhere, since it is getting the effect that Blizzard wants in the game world, which is people out and about and filling up the empty zones.
Post by
Wowpixel
I think it's hard to judge numbers by the vocal minority on the internet. I think that the vast majority of players- especially new players- don't use the forums.
That is true (but folks don't use the forums for the forum antics more than not knowing it's existence. It's very catty).
A major problem is how players judge the popularity by what they see on their realms, too. If you're on a high population server and it's battlegroup has at least another popular realm, they can't see the problems faced on lower population servers. They only see the gravy, when most realms are medium population.
WoW is a MMO and touts it's numbers, when those numbers are selective (that 10 million divided worldwide on 251+ realms) even CRZ doesn't bump up the feeling of many players playing. MoP on my realm is as dead as zones with CRZ, and that's not a comforting thought (where are those 10 million?). Furthermore, CRZ/RaidID also hurts having a sense of realm community. When there was a Horde invasion in the tram the other day - some 40 players - once it was known it wasn't our realm, folks left. What's the point of helping folks who more than likely would rather step over your body than help? Where if it was realm based it would be, "Hey, that's ABC guild, let's help them, as they helped us in DEF raid".
CRZ fixes the numbers issue (to appear there's more playing) but it adds little for a sense of community. It's like those Wal-Mart sized guilds with 800 on the roster, but maybe 30 online at any time, a parking lot of alts.
WoW needs a community of more sharing is caring, not Every Man for Himself. That keeps players happy as it's a social game.
Post by
Adamsm
WoW needs a community of more sharing is caring, not Every Man for Himself. That keeps players happy as it's a social game.
That really has nothing to do with CRZ; it's about the players, and that's how a section of them have acted since Vanilla. I remember when I was on a PVP server and getting camped by a level 60, I saw other 60's of my faction just keep going and they didn't stop to help.
Sadly, short of removing a massive population of the servers, or implementing mandatory shock collars for everyone that zaps them when they do something #$%^ish, not much you can do about that type of player.
Post by
Wowpixel
Define 'so much'. I think people care, because they care about the game.Yet the sub number has nothing at all to do with the game itself; I could care less if there are 10 mil players or only 10, as long as I can play the game. People can whine, !@#$% and moan all they want; but really, quit the game and go be 'happier'.
People don't quit if they find something that makes them happy about the game.
Those same people though will disagree on the direction of the game. WoW is a faddish game and fads die out, and the worry is playing too much to the numbers to promote the game, while other problems exist. Simple problems add up to be annoying enough for players to find something more fun to play.
Do you like carrying an alt on a 2 seater mount, enter another zone and he's dismounted?
Do you like phasing where you can't even see what your alt sees, then he dies due to it?
It's not that the players wouldn't enjoy playing more, it's that the annoyance factor adds up. If your goal is to have 10 toons at 90, and facing those 2 issues going through every CRZ/true zone, how do you expect them to feel? They want to play, they invested the time, but they tire of such annoyances...and will state by how much, in hopes it will improve.
Nothing gets done in a vacuum, there needs to be feedback to improve the product.
Post by
Adamsm
Do you like carrying an alt on a 2 seater mount, enter another zone and he's dismounted? Is it wrong I still laugh at that? I find it hilarious in all honesty.
As for having multiple toons at 90; considering just how many different way there are too level, if you don't want to play around in CRZ, you actually don't have to. And when I level an alt, I'm alone; I don't have a second account working with it.
Post by
Wowpixel
Do you like carrying an alt on a 2 seater mount, enter another zone and he's dismounted? Is it wrong I still laugh at that? I find it hilarious in all honesty.
As for having multiple toons at 90; considering just how many different way there are too level, if you don't want to play around in CRZ, you actually don't have to. And when I level an alt, I'm alone; I don't have a second account working with it.
Actually, if you prefer to quest to level it's the only way. Dungeons don't reward as much XP as quests do (especially loading up on them). And efforts of taking alts into higher zones where killing trash or exploration bonuses were higher...now are all scaled to level. So no more 1000 XP for killing a level 67 mob @ 21. No more 2200 XP taking out an alt to Northrend at level 10 for the exploration bonuses. No more fast leveling in battlegrounds.
Let's also don't talk about being in full BoAs and how long the rested XP will last (gone in a mere 3 levels) while leveling lower level toons.
You can go from level 80 to 84 1/2 with full rested XP though...
It's why to speak up, since it shouldn't be harder to level from 1-20 (burning through all the rested XP in 3 levels), than 80-85 (with a mere 50% at regular XP @ 84 left). The leveling pacing is off. It's just more annoyances, in an otherwise good game -- and why take the chances of scaring players away due to it?
Post by
Adamsm
Dungeons don't reward as much XP as quests do (especially loading up on them).Um...huh? Since Cata, dungeon running racks up the levels far faster then questing, since you out level a quest zone in next to no time, 'forcing' you to run off to the next. And if you are in full BoA's, once you hit 15, you don't have to leave a city until level 80 when it is faster at that point to quest in the Cata zones, since half of your Boa's stop working at that point. I am a quester, but since Cata, I just go back for the fun quests once I'm level capped.
. It's just more annoyances, in an otherwise good game -- and why take the chances of scaring players away due to it?Yet, it's been that way since Cata, when they made the leveling process so much more stream lined. Yes I'm sure that some completely newbs to MMO's saw PVP and thought something completely different...but then again, that's why there are so many different realms to play on.
Post by
deathbyte
I still don't get why people care about the numbers so much.
In Lanky's case he wants to try and prove that CRZ has ruined the game, which it hasn't imo.
I have a feeling yuo may see a couple hundred thousand drops but thats about it with all the advertising they did I think the reeled in alot more people then we think.
Post by
lankybrit
I still don't get why people care about the numbers so much.
In Lanky's case he wants to try and prove that CRZ has ruined the game, which it hasn't imo.
I have a feeling yuo may see a couple hundred thousand drops but thats about it with all the advertising they did I think the reeled in alot more people then we think.
Tee hee. Not really. Made my decision to come back to the game, CRZ and all.
Cheers.
Post by
Adamsm
I have a feeling yuo may see a couple hundred thousand drops but thats about it with all the advertising they did I think the reeled in alot more people then we think.
I don't think we're gonna see any drop at all to be completely honest; heck, it may even end up back at the 11 mil mark.
Post by
murphmanfa
It's why to speak up, since it shouldn't be harder to level from 1-20 (burning through all the rested XP in 3 levels), than 80-85 (with a mere 50% at regular XP @ 84 left). The leveling pacing is off. It's just more annoyances, in an otherwise good game -- and why take the chances of scaring players away due to it?
Using rested XP as a gauge for how difficult a leveling bracket is is a poor measure. Yes, it lasts for three levels, but you can go up five (or more!) in one sitting; and in that one sitting of questing below 25 you'd go up several levels, where you would see perhaps one, at most, during the same amount of time at higher levels.
Additionally the main difficulties of the very early levels are learning the class mechanics- and even then you're eased into them. If you're finding the opening areas more difficult than the later stuff, then I would say that you've been missing something along the way that's right in front of your nose.
Post by
lankybrit
9.6 Million.
BTW: On the call, they said that most of the subscription losses were in China, and that the US was fairly stable.
Cheers.
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