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Isn't selling gold.... illegal ?
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Post by
Crimzonblood
So I've been told...I myself am sort of a fanboy for WoW. I buy the collector's editions/pets/etc. I love blizzard. I love the game.
But my friend...not so much haha. He plays it, but dislikes the fact that money is "hard to make"(rofl, idk how..)
So he 'invests' in a gold buying site. Here's what the site does : He pays via paypal, they say his order is fulfilled, and he never gets the money he paid for.(sadly, he 'invested' 40$ in it)
But what can he really do? Well, he can tell paypal that the charge was fraudulent and he never received his goods, right? The gold buying site told him if he reports it as fraudulent, they're going to sue him..
How can a company offering ILLEGAL SERVICES, sue someone for being cheated out of his money?
They can't prove they indeed did give him his gold, can they?(this is the part that gets me) How are they gonna do that? Go on his account and show him? rofl? Show him a receipt in WoW ? Contact a GM and tell him that he refuses to pay for the gold he bought?
So I'm just wondering...Should he honestly report it as a fraudulent charge on his paypal ?
Your friend is SOL.
Contact a GM and he probably gets banned. Contact Paypal and they don't really have to do anything, because both buying and selling gold is illegal.
Tell your friend that if he wants to continue playing WoW, don't do anything. Just learn to make gold using the AH or farming.
Post by
Cloaked
I have a question, and a possible point on this...
Most gold selling sites // power leveling sites usually disclaimer the fact that you are not in fact buying gold/power leveling from them, but you are in fact buying the time they invest on your behalf. Since he never got the time invested on his behalf, doesn't that make the issue, outside of Blizzards EULA mind you, a binding legal contract which was breached?
Just a thought... I agree with he was stupid and deserved it, but as an avid law fan-boy... thoughts?
EDIT: Wouldn't blizzard under their own EULA not be able to ban the account, due to the fact that the
INTENTION
did not result in an
ACTION
that was against the EULA?
Post by
44284
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Post by
Karrie
Blizz ToS (Gold selling part, that is) isn't really recognized as "breaking the law" outside of it's own services
Actually, the gold selling companies are selling a commodity to which they do not have any legal claim. WoW gold is, like everything else in WoW, Blizzard's property. In simple terms, they are selling stolen goods.
Wrong. They don't create gold by hacking or exploiting the game. When they receive an order, they don't break into the database and grant their characters 50k gold which they then mail to you. Now that would be illegal.
They are merely selling the result of a certain amount of time that they invested in the game. Farming gold is not against the ToS and neither is mailing gold to another player. It's like asking a friend to do 25 daily quests for you. The only difference here is the fact that you pay chinese farmers in a certain curency and your friend in naturals.
Whether you like it or not, there is nothing going on here that would justify a lawsuit or account ban.
PS: Don't buy from those websites that are being spammed ingame.
Post by
Interest
Blizz ToS (Gold selling part, that is) isn't really recognized as "breaking the law" outside of it's own services
Actually, the gold selling companies are selling a commodity to which they do not have any legal claim. WoW gold is, like everything else in WoW, Blizzard's property. In simple terms, they are selling stolen goods.
Wrong. They don't create gold by hacking or exploiting the game. When they receive an order, they don't break into the database and grant their characters 50k gold which they then mail to you. Now that would be illegal.
They are merely selling the result of a certain amount of time that they invested in the game. Farming gold is not against the ToS and neither is mailing gold to another player. It's like asking a friend to do 25 daily quests for you. The only difference here is the fact that you pay chinese farmers in a certain curency and your friend in naturals.
Whether you like it or not, there is nothing going on here that would justify a lawsuit or account ban.
PS: Don't buy from those websites that are being spammed ingame.
The act of actually selling the gold, regardless of the source, is illegal.
Doesn't matter if it's off those Volatile Fires they sell or a hacked account (the usual source, might I add). Gold is gold. And it's quite illegal to sell it.
Creating gold requires GM intervention in some sort of way anyways...(harshly disciplined against from what I hear), and I doubt it's possible to hack the gold otherwise.
Post by
392933
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Post by
114794
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Post by
Adamsm
It's also very likely that they sent him the gold in the mail, and it was intercepted by a GM. There is a lag of 1 hour on gold and items sent from an outside account for a reason - gold buying/selling is one of these.
Then he would be banned....or at least his 'friend' would be banned heh.
Post by
Interest
It's also very likely that they sent him the gold in the mail, and it was intercepted by a GM. There is a lag of 1 hour on gold and items sent from an outside account for a reason - gold buying/selling is one of these.
Then he would be banned....or at least his 'friend' would be banned heh.
^ This.
Post by
138638
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392933
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524425
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142329
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Post by
pezz
Is it illegal, or just a violation of the ToS? IIRC, part of the problem is jurisdiction, if its illegal in the US but the seller is in Vietnam, can he be arrested?
either way, its still stupid and worth a lifetime ban.
I'd imagine they'd have to convince the Vietnamese government to extradite the gold seller before prosecuting... which, all in all, is probably not worth 40 bucks in this specific case, or even some in-game shinies.
Post by
91278
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Post by
Kailhun
I think we all agree:
if Blizzard finds out about the fact the 'friend' paid to have gold delivered, they will ban him. The texts we scroll past and never read, gives them that right in the legal relationship between player and blizzard.
Post by
440695
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Post by
Magician22773
The devil really is in the details.
In Missouri at least, it is illegal to charge more than face value for a concert or sporting event ticket. So those front row seats to see Taylor Swift or the KC Chiefs can only be sold for the say, $60 face value legally. BUT, if I want, I can sell you a piece of bubble-gum for $500, and include those tickets for free. Nothing says bubble-gum can't be sold for $500 a piece.
The same applies to WoW gold. They can't legally sell you gold, per the TOS /EULA, but they can, sell you a text doc, a trading card, or any other non-protected item, and GIVE you 20k gold for free. That is where the "for any reason, or no reason at all" clause comes in. Assuming that your gold hacker is at least smart enough to skirt this easy loophole, they technicly haven't even broken Blizzard's own rules (yet we all know they really have), so your ban is really for "no reason at all". But you are still just as banned.
Post by
lonewarrior
Paypal has terms of agreement too. These sites probably use Paypal the way a guild can host it on their website to collect money for vent. If Paypal is made aware of their illegal usage they can stop use privileges.
I doubt any gold selling company is stationed in the US. This makes legal activities against them very difficult, but also makes it difficult for them to do anything to you and I doubt these numnuts are going to pay a lawyer to file any legal papers. Just call their bluff and stop payment.
Call up the credit card used in your paypal account and stop the charges. It's the legal right of every consumer. It's called chargeback.
A chargeback is when the credit card company withdraws the money for a transaction from a merchant's account and deposited in a consumer's following a dispute.
Basically, you do a chargeback when you feel like you're not getting what you paid for, in terms of the quality or type of good or service.
To start a chargeback, contact your credit card company and ask. A dispute process begins and the merchant will have to provide proof they rendered service properly. If the merchant can't provide sufficient evidence, the credit card company debits the transaction amount from the merchant's account and credits it to your account.
Additionally, the credit card company charges the merchant a chargeback fee.
We urge consumers to only use chargebacks as a last resort and never before making several attempts to resolve an issue directly with a merchant. The last step before doing a chargeback is to threaten to use one. Sometimes that's enough to change a vendor's mind and let them know you're serious.
Post by
671564
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