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10.2.7
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Weapon choices for prot
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Post by
Raleandris
I still haven't been able to replicate these results with HotR hitting harder single target, even with 2pc T10, Glyphed and in nearly full 25H gear, with a normal Havoc's Call.
Post by
93865
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Squishalot
This is just plain wrong.
Care to explain?
Hotr does more damage than crusader strike (atm my strike hits about 500ish, while hotr hits 700ish). Checked with glyph of Hotr and
heirloom sword
. I am guessing there will be similar results with slow dps 1hander.
It may change with high vengeance stacks but i still see exactly no point in using Cstrike.
It depends on whether the 'extra' damage on HotR scales at all with SP/AP. I can't find a source online saying it scales at all (or not).
If it doesn't scale, then chances are, you're not geared enough to see CS do more than HotR, since CS scales 3x more with AP.
I still haven't been able to replicate these results with HotR hitting harder single target, even with 2pc T10, Glyphed and in nearly full 25H gear, with a normal Havoc's Call.
Try a high armor target.
That'll only impact the bonus holy damage. Do you know if it scales?
Post by
blademeld
It depends on whether the 'extra' damage on HotR scales at all with SP/AP. I can't find a source online saying it scales at all (or not).
It scales, there was an issue with the holy part not scaling with Vengeance stacks because Touched by the Light only used strength.
That was resolved a while back.
Post by
Squishalot
Is there a confirmed figure on the scaling amount then?
Post by
blademeld
I wish I knew.
Post by
424512
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
138583
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Raleandris
How would I know if a certain boss/target is high armor?
All boss targets are high armor.
And I still haven't seen HotR out-damage CS against them.
Post by
93865
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
blademeld
EDIT: as of Nov 30, 2008, testing has been done on all bosses and it appears that for now, all bosses have the same armor value shown on Maexxna: 13083 armor. This is true for heroics and regular versions of the bosses, and 10 and 25 man raid versions.
This value was lowered to ~10k with the release of Ulduar.
Don't listen to Aestu.
When you're testing HotR, do you have Vengeance up?
I don't know how the holy portion scales, but that might have something to do with it.
Post by
93865
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
138583
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
blademeld
EDIT: I think I actually remember this particular individual from the official paladin forums; he chain posted on a low level alt (also a gnome) and was eventually revealed to a bench riding paladin in a mediocre Quebec guild who was sat for most progression. I am trying to remember the name but it escapes me atm.
FYI, I never posted on the official forums.
You mentioned naxx specifically, I didn't mention anything anything about Ulduar other than relating it to the change of the armour value of the Naxx bosses.
Understudies aren't bosses.
I suppose you being wrong is ignorable while my mistakes are above standard.
I don't even recall making any mistake with you around other than the DR formula when I assumed the other person was correct in admitting that the macro was wrong.
Its kinda hard to test anything with vengeance up due to very chaotic nature of vengeance.
It would be easier if the HotR coefficient was easily accessable.
Post by
299264
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
blademeld
Why don't we skip the one-upmanship and ad hominems? They don't add anything to the discussion, especially when it comes to questions where there are definite answers that merely need to be located.
As a community, I reckon our focus should be on helping one another and considering ideas and opinions on their merits. Of course, politeness and a reasonable effort to search for information first on the part of those inquiring is always preferable.
You aren't committing one-upmanship or saying an ad hominem, you're fine.
The problem is that Aestu has
contributed absolutely nothing to this thread
or most of the other threads he's been to. His wording for the definition of normalization, as Djane pointed out, has changed to cover everything from speed to damage to DPS.
He cannot accept any mistakes he make and has shown so far in this thread alone that he is incapable of understanding negatives, prepositions, formulas and terminology.
Of course, everything I say is wrong too since I don't reveal my character. Like I need a character to prove that if 1 + 1 = 2 then 2 - 1 = 1
Post by
Djane
And in the interest of easy access to said inconsistancy. Let's see that again. In slow motion this time.
Your post is non sequitor. You don't understand what the word "normalized" means. It means weapon speed is a non-factor and the damage done is based directly off DPS.
Crusader Strike, in its current implementation, goes directly off weapon damage.
Bam. Cstrike is NOT normalized. Weapon speed is a significant factor in the damage it deals.
And in terms of revealing characters. I'm quite happy to reveal mine. It's linked to my profile. I also trust Blademeld to know what the hell he's talking about regardless of whether he reveals his own.
Post by
Squishalot
And in the interest of easy access to said inconsistancy. Let's see that again. In slow motion this time.
Your post is non sequitor. You don't understand what the word "normalized" means. It means weapon speed is a non-factor and the damage done is based directly off DPS.
Crusader Strike, in its current implementation, goes directly off weapon damage.
Bam. Cstrike is NOT normalized. Weapon speed is a significant factor in the damage it deals.
In the context of what he was saying, he was very consistent.
1) HotR old was 'normalised' - 4x DPS. Seal of Righteousness damage is normalised - weapon speed is used as a factor in the equation to equalise DPS no matter what speed weapon you use.
2) CS damage is % of weapon damage, not a multiple of DPS, nor does it use weapon speed in its calculation.
3) If 'normalise' means weapon speed doesn't matter, then NOT normalised means weapon speed does matter.
Aestu's view hasn't changed, as far as I can tell.
And Djane - please learn to close your quotes.
Post by
93865
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Djane
1) Never questioned old Hotr. Not really relevant. We know current HotR isn't normalised.
2) Normalisation has NOTHING to do with the weapon damage. They are normalized around WEAPON SPEED.. If this wasn't true then why...
3)
Crusader Strike
-> explain the nature of effects 1 and 2 if normalisation is based around weapon damage? 2 would be superfluous if normalisation involved damage.
And yes, thanks. Knew i forgot something.
4)Aestu. I note you're ignoring my comments entirely in regards to pointing out inconsistancies in your argument. I would appreciate some feedback in regards to this.
5)I do not believe those statements can possibly remain consistant Squishalot when one says normalisation states weapon speed does not matter and a latter one states weapon speed is significant. These statements are mutually exclusive.
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