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Clicker = Means i can't tank?
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Post by
297395
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
pelf
My entire point is that even if he had mad skills, it STILL couldn't be better then keybinding just by the physics of it.
Well, a mouse moving across a mousepad
does
have more
momentum
than a finger moving from one key to another...
Post by
ignis86
i think that everyone (or most) in this thread honestly just need to take a nice helping of shutup. lol
all i was reminded of while reading this was the whole debate of druids cant tank... if youre not a warrior you suck as a tank etc etc etc....
its two different playstyles... you CAN NOT say which is better as what is better or not is IN THE CHAIR, not in the method.
Post by
109094
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Kaitain
i think that everyone (or most) in this thread honestly just need to take a nice helping of shutup. lol
all i was reminded of while reading this was the whole debate of druids cant tank... if youre not a warrior you suck as a tank etc etc etc....
its two different playstyles... you CAN NOT say which is better as what is better or not is IN THE CHAIR, not in the method.
You also don't have a valid opinion if you haven't used both methods extensively, and I'm pretty sure most of this thread is fueled by pure ignorance.
just like to revise my previous statements.
Malygos just went down and few minutes ago and in no small part was in thanks to my clicking tanking of the boss. Thats every boss done. (except Sarth +3 which is tomorrow)
Clicking for the win
mmmmm taste that satisfaction.
The point was made very early on in the thread that there is nothing challenging enough in PvE to require optimised keybinding. You should have ignored all the posts that said only keybinders can tank. Unfortunately you sank to their level.
Post by
109094
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Post by
Kaitain
You also said that you have never tried keybinding, rendering all your arguments as pointless as theirs.
Post by
Caleiopeia
I tried keybinding as feral dps, but it doesn't work out for me. I went back to clicking and it is much easier for me to keep my rotation up. My dps went up as soon as I decided to go back to clicking.
Post by
109094
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Celdhyrean
In my opinion, that's like all the BC starting warlocks who were saying that they were doing better dps as destruction than affliction even while clearly not having the gear for this to be realistic. ie they weren't able to adapt to the playstyle or simply didn't like it and thus performed less well than they could have.
Which is fine after all, it's a game that you are playing for your pleasure and if things work out then good, but it has to be taken back to a matter of personal preference (which you did, i'm not taking a jab at you) rather than to objective arguments about efficiency.
I don't know, maybe clicking and keybinding are two different set of skills but i hardly find it difficult to know what skills i'm using in my rotation and to be able to put the finger at the right place automatically without having to leave sight of the screen. I also tend to think that spamming a key around the end of the GCD can only be more efficient than spamming the mouse button.
My opinion is that it should be scientifically provable that keyboard is more efficient than mouse (from equal in a low stress/number of actions environment to more and more better as those parameters increase), but as i said, if it works for you then good for you.
As for the problems between two set of keybinds, i don't see them. Things i've experienced are problems when switching specs (I'm still trying to cast UA at times after several months of not being affliction, good thing there's nothing bound there for the moment) or problems like jumping down a cliff thinking i could hit flight form (but that's has nothing to do with keybinds). I really don't have a single problem switching from druid to warlock even if the main spells are on different buttons.
Post by
109094
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Post by
Katsudon
Long story short, do whatever works for you. Try both methods out, and give them each a long enough time to get used to it before you decide to stick with one. Mixing also works well too (i mix keybinding and clicking). Same applys to UI modifications (The first time i used one, i hated it, went back to blizz standards, fast-forward another year and a half, tried some UI mods again, hated it, but gave it some time, and it grew on me; now i use them)
You can do pretty much anything, as this game isn't difficult enough that reaction time differences of .1-.2seconds or something mean anything significant.
Post by
Kaitain
You also said that you have never tried keybinding, rendering all your arguments as pointless as theirs.
I said that did I?
Care to point out where I said specifically that I
never
tried keybinding at all.
Or did I simply say that I never tried keybinding across
multiple toons
because of the problems I have heard it causes?
k fine. What confused me is how it is possible to properly try keybinding (for days, not hours, as all advice on the subject clearly indicates there is a learning curve), without witnessing whether it would indeed mess up your other characters. Or rather, whether you had already messed up your other characters, as the deed was already done. It's a pretty amazing given that there's a checkbox right at the top of the keybinding window that lets you apply the setting to all or just one character. That was why i assumed your sentence earlier in the thread referred to keybinding in general.
I agree. Keybinding works fine.
I simply refute the statement that if you click you cant tank in this game or by extension, that if you click you canot play this game well enough to be able to compete with a keybinder.
Again, stated several times in the first few pages by 4 or 5 people that PvE tanking is not hard enough to require keybinding. You could have left it at "I farm all current bosses with clicking and find it easy".
The problem comes when anyone utters the opinion that clicking is
better
as it's opening a really big can of worms. First problem is the idea of "better". You have to assess what each player's goals are, and whether they feel they achieve them. As it's a game and the ultimate goal is just having fun, it's pretty much impossible to fail in Warcraft. You could use downright awful methods for everything and not fail, then argue that your methods are great because you didn't fail.
But most people make inevitable assumptions and skip straight to quantifying "better". Unfortunately for clickers, keybinders have all the ammunition for that debate. Established UI science, pro guild raid progress and arena ratings are all ways you can quantify keybinding as being "better". Clickers have almost no way to quantify the method as better other than things like "my idiot guildie messed up his alt's config with his main's keybinds".
You can do pretty much anything, as this game isn't difficult enough that reaction time differences of .1-.2seconds or something mean anything significant.
It's not really about that. It's about where your eyes are, where your focus is, and how many tasks are assigned to your left hand and how many to your right hand.
Post by
109094
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Post by
129046
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Celdhyrean
My eyes are on my screen.
My mouse pointer is on my screen.
My buttons are on my screen.
My keyboard is not on my screen.I completely agree with what Nnoutaja said, I'll just add this to correct your example the way it works for most keybinders (the good ones at least):
My eyes are on my screen.
My mouse pointer is on my screen.
My buttons/skills are on my keyboard which is not on my screen
but which i don't need to look at
.
ie we have one less thing to look at instead of one more.
Post by
Kaitain
My eyes are on my screen.
My mouse pointer is on my screen.
My buttons are on my screen.
My keyboard is not on my screen.
This is probably the crux of it. The idea of keybinding is that you don't look at your keyboard, ever. For the very small percentage of people who can't do that (or the much larger percentage who don't spend any time learning how), clicking will be faster.
On a more factual note, you can't focus on your entire screen at once, and that is a very important point. The area of the screen you can see with enough clarity to perform a task that requires detailed discrimination (for example distinguishing between 2 same-colour bossmods bars, or click on a default sized action bar button) is about a
2-4cm in diameter
, depending on how close you sit to your screen (~ a 2% visual angle). Whether they realise it or not, that is one of the largest benefits people feel when they switch to keybinding - they no longer have to look at any of their action bars, which dramatically cuts how much their eyes need to criss cross their screen.
Post by
109094
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
109094
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Kaitain
I am a User Interface designer by trade, and have been doing it since I left college about 12 years ago.
In my professional opinion, keybinding
IS
better. This opinion is backed up by scientific proof. In 4 years of playing wow I have not heard any arguments for clicking to convince me otherwise, and I do listen to both sides of the argument. Most people giving opinions on this matter do not fully understand what they are talking about, and this thread is proof of that.
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