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Immolate (and Corruption) - Worth it or not in 0/21/40 shadow?
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Post by
Temes
The topic says it all.
Post by
Dunsinane
"It depends"
But at most gear levels, yes.
Post by
Temes
So instead of the Curse + SB, you Doom + Immolate + SB, putting immolate and Doom up everytime they go down?
Post by
Dunsinane
On boss mobs and single/double-pull trash, yes. I usually won't bother with immolate on weak trash.
On a pure damage basis, immolate (allowed to run its full duration) will always do more as a function of cast time than shadow bolt will unless you have stacked significant shadow-specific damage. Shadow-specific buffs (ISB, for example) can skew this toward shadow bolt at higher levels of spell damage and crit.
Post by
Temes
On boss mobs and single/double-pull trash, yes. I usually won't bother with immolate on weak trash.
On a pure damage basis, immolate (allowed to run its full duration) will always do more as a function of cast time than shadow bolt will unless you have stacked significant shadow-specific damage. Shadow-specific buffs (ISB, for example) can skew this toward shadow bolt at higher levels of spell damage and crit.
What about Corruption, with T5 or T4 bonuses? (T6 sucks, but you could note that too)
Post by
99026
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Dunsinane
No. No. No. Do not, not, NOT attempt to compare a peak output shadow bolt with the damage done by a dot for any fight that lasts long enough for the dot to run its full course. It tells us nothing.
Assuming Ruin, Bane, sacced succubus, and SnF and ignoring the effects of ISB, Emberstorm and Impr Immolate. I'm giving shadow bolt huge bonuses and have done nothing for Immloate.
x = spell damage
y = spel crit chance, expressed as a fraction
Damage done by Immolate, allowed to run its full course:
((1+y)(327+.2x))+(615+.65x))
Damage done by shadow bolt:
1.15((1+y)(572+1.0571x))
Damage output per time spent casting at 1k spell damage, 25% crit
Immolate = 1200
Shadow Bolt = 936.675
At 1200 spell damage, 25% crit
Immolate = 1402.5
Shadow Bolt = 1150.325
At 1k spell damage, 30% crit
Immolate = 1213.4
Shadow Bolt = 974.142
At 1500 spell damage, 30% crit
Immolate = 1603.4
Shadow Bolt = 1290.2747
Low end numbers for 0/21/40. High end numbers for 0/21/40. No talents beyond Bane boosting Immolate. And in all cases, Immolate is worthwhile - and still would be even if ISB was up 100% of the time and you never had improved scorch available to you.
I repeat - unless you have a significant amount of shadow damage in your gear or the raid debuffs heavily favor shadow damage (CoS and Shadow Weaveing, no CoEl or Impr. Scorch), Immolate should be a part of a base 0/21/40 rotation on any fight where it can be expected to run its full course if your intention is to maximize your personal damage. As you increase your crit percentage, your ability to maintain ISB in a shadow-heavy raid may dictate otherwise, as may a raid which is hitting the debuff cap.
Post by
99026
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Dunsinane
Running their defaults, with 17% crit (for the 25% I list), hit capped, and 1k spell damage
with Immolate: 863.5 dps
without Immolate: 859.4 dps
That's with the benefit of ISB in their favor as well.
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