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Moderation and posting
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Post by
Hyperspacerebel
Those are all examples of a mod trying to reign in a situation where the environment has become biased on either side. They are all modding--and they are all a neutral position, because they are trying to stop what is becoming a gang up on someone and what will lead to a thread being locked.
They are trying to make sure everyone's point of view is seen.
That last bit makes no sense to me. If you want your point of view seen, you post it. If you don't, you don't. There's no need for a mod or anyone else to do anything. If 99% of the community's "point of view" is X and only 1% is Y, why does a mod need to come in and "make Y seen"?
Post by
Ashelia
Those are all examples of a mod trying to reign in a situation where the environment has become biased on either side. They are all modding--and they are all a neutral position, because they are trying to stop what is becoming a gang up on someone and what will lead to a thread being locked.
They are trying to make sure everyone's point of view is seen.
That last bit makes no sense to me. If you want your point of view seen, you post it. If you don't, you don't. There's no need for a mod or anyone else to do anything. If 99% of the community's "point of view" is X and only 1% is Y, why does a mod need to come in and "make Y seen"?
If someone posts, for example, that they really like a dungeon... and the first four posts after are "LOL THAT DUNGEON SUCKS" or sarcastic remarks... then a mod should jump in and say "Hey, that dungeon isn't so bad! Remember, guys, try to be a little more constructive."
There is never a 99% to 1% point of view ratio, except maybe in gold selling. It can look like that, because a few vocal people jumped on someone instantly, which tends to make people who disagree afraid to speak their mind.(##RESPBREAK##)2##DELIM##Ashelia##DELIM##
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
If someone posts, for example, that they really like a dungeon... and the first four posts after are "LOL THAT DUNGEON SUCKS" or sarcastic remarks... then a mod should jump in and say "Hey, that dungeon isn't so bad! Remember, guys, try to be a little more constructive."
I think that's one of the worst things a mod could post as mod. When an opinion is stated ("that dungeon isn't so bad") by a mod in a post that is meant to moderate the thread, it comes across as the mod just using his or her position to make their opinion more authoritative.
Why can't the mod just say or do what needs to be said (e.g. just the second sentence of your example)? Or edit the posts that broke the rules. Or delete them. Why is it necessary for the mod to take a side?
There is never a 99% to 1% point of view ratio, except maybe in gold selling. It can look like that, because a few vocal people jumped on someone instantly, which tends to make people who disagree afraid to speak their mind.
Do you know how rare it is for us "few vocal people" to agree? There just as much variance of opinion among us as the rest of the site. So I don't see how that makes it okay for mods to defend a side they decide isn't being expressed loud enough.
Post by
Ashelia
There is never a 99% to 1% point of view ratio, except maybe in gold selling. It can look like that, because a few vocal people jumped on someone instantly, which tends to make people who disagree afraid to speak their mind.
Do you know how rare it is for us "few vocal people" to agree? There just as much variance of opinion among us as the rest of the site. So I don't see how that makes it okay for mods to defend a side they decide isn't being expressed loud enough.
The Off-topic people aren't what I meant by vocal people. I meant in general, sometimes people who disagree the most with a post will reply first and silence a topic. That's why a mod will often jump in with another side of view or offer the thread a second chance--they aren't defending, they are opening a discussion that a couple of people nearly closed by replying the way they did. By replying with an offer of another opinion, it frequently enables people who didn't want to be first to express that opinion a chance to say theirs now that they know they aren't alone.(##RESPBREAK##)2##DELIM##Ashelia##DELIM##
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
The Off-topic people aren't what I meant by vocal people.
Why bring up Off-topic? I assumed we were talking generally about WoW General topics...at least that's where I took my example from.
I consider myself quite vocal in WoW General (at least in the more controversial threads). And it's very, very rare for me to be in agreement with more than 1 other person in the thread. If anyone usually brings another side to threads, it's me.
I meant in general, sometimes people who disagree the most with a post will reply first and silence a topic. That's why a mod will often jump in with another side of view or offer the thread a second chance--they aren't defending, they are opening a discussion that a couple of people nearly closed by replying the way they did.
What in your example post promotes the topic any more than the example OP does? Promoting the topic, as seems to be implied the sentence "Remember, guys, try to be a little more constructive," would involve giving reason and arguments as to why a dungeon is or isn't good. But if a mod were to do that, it would be no different than a normal person giving their opinion and arguing for it except for the weight of having green text.
Post by
Ashelia
The Off-topic people aren't what I meant by vocal people.
Why bring up Off-topic? I assumed we were talking generally about WoW General topics...at least that's where I took my example from.
I consider myself quite vocal in WoW General (at least in the more controversial threads). And it's very, very rare for me to be in agreement with more than 1 other person in the thread. If anyone usually brings another side to threads, it's me.
The way you phrased it made it sound like you meant the more vocal users that you were friends with. Sorry for misunderstanding.
What in your example post promotes the topic any more than the example OP does? Promoting the topic, as seems to be implied the sentence "Remember, guys, try to be a little more constructive," would involve giving reason and arguments as to why a dungeon is or isn't good. But if a mod were to do that, it would be no different than a normal person giving their opinion and arguing for it except for the weight of having green text.
They are posting a different opinion with a different colored text because it's a reminder that people are watching and opinions may be different. They could post blanket statements constantly, sure--but I'm willing to bet if mods only replied with "Remember to keep it on topic" or "This is against our rules," after 10-15 moderations like that, people would start to say that our mods are being too serious and are killing the threads. These are fun forums, they are supposed to be light-hearted, and as such, when a mod posts, they don't just have a boilerplate they pull 3-4 responses from and reiterate them from.
In general, a response that is used again and again also comes off as very serious. For example, if I said, "I feel you are off touch, please review the forum rules" vs. "I disagree, a lot of people have different opinions! Remember not to silence people =)"--which one would be responded to better? Wouldn't the serious one sort of kill the thread and seem out of place in a rather light discussion about video games?
Personally (unrelated to my position as an employee at Wowhead), I would find it really annoying if mods did not have personality. It would also be completely different from how nearly every other website in this industry reacts if they just said the same thing to every thread. Blizzard's mods post like ours for the most part. As we are a site dedicated to a Blizzard product, it makes sense for us to keep the same personality present.(##RESPBREAK##)2##DELIM##Ashelia##DELIM##
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
They are posting a different opinion with a different colored text because it's a reminder that people are watching and opinions may be different. They could post blanket statements constantly, sure--but I'm willing to bet if mods only replied with "Remember to keep it on topic" or "This is against our rules," after 10-15 moderations like that, people would start to say that our mods are being too serious and are killing the threads. These are fun forums, they are supposed to be light-hearted, and as such, when a mod posts, they don't just have a boilerplate they pull 3-4 responses from and reiterate them from.
Or maybe if they actually modded correctly, there would be less call for them to actually mod.
If a post is actually breaking the rules, and it is dealt with, and there is follow-up, then people would begin to learn what is in the rules and what isn't, instead of having to hope a certain mod agrees with their opinion and not the other guy's.
I think Aestu is the perfect example. You haven't been around that long, but I can tell you exactly why the whole thing got out of hand: mods got involved, but let most of what was happening slide. So what happened next? Every regular ran with it.
It seems to me you're trying to bail out a bad system.
In general, a response that is used again and again also comes off as very serious. For example, if I said, "I feel you are off touch, please review the forum rules" vs. "I disagree, a lot of people have different opinions! Remember not to silence people =)"--which one would be responded to better? Wouldn't the serious one sort of kill the thread and seem out of place in a rather light discussion about video games?
So why do mods get to state blanket opinions like that without backing them up, but other people don't (because that's exactly what you seem to be against)?
Yes a lot of people have different opinions,
and you (as a mod) are disagreeing with some!
A mod's opinion isn't any more special than any other opinion.
What
is
special about a mod is that they have the power of moderation, and it's precisely that power that is being brought in along side their statements of opinion.
Personally (unrelated to my position as an employee at Wowhead), I would find it really annoying if mods did not have personality. It would also be completely different from how nearly every other website in this industry reacts if they just said the same thing to every thread. Blizzard's mods post like ours for the most part. As we are a site dedicated to a Blizzard product, it makes sense for us to keep the same personality present.
Blizzard also has some of the worst moderation of any forum. I don't think that's a comparison you want to be making.
But as I said, I don't care about mods being active in the community. It just needs to be clear whether they're actually participating in the thread or they're laying down the law.
Post by
asakawa
Blizzard also has some of the worst moderation of any forum. I don't think that's a comparison you want to be making.
...in your opinion.
how did such a potentially interesting thread get so quickly and so badly derailed by hyper's agenda?
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
Blizzard also has some of the worst moderation of any forum. I don't think that's a comparison you want to be making.
...in your opinion.
It's a quite popular and known opinion. And if you don't realize that, you're not paying much attention.
how did such a potentially interesting thread get so quickly and so badly derailed by hyper's agenda?
My "agenda" is to confront issues is see in the moderation of this site, where I spend a very large chunk of my time. That's been my agenda on and off for almost 2 years now.
This thread, being about "
Moderation and posting
" is the exact place and a perfect opportunity for me to voice my agenda.
I see no problem trying to have a constructive argument over the state of Wowhead, and you're welcome to participate. But otherwise don't bother (with me at least), because I'll be too busy dealing with the issues, not snickering at other people.
Post by
asakawa
"popular" and "known" aren't exactly verifiable attributes for an opinion and if they were they still wouldn't make what you said anything more than simply your opinion. your opinion is perfectly fine but it isn't given more weight when stated as fact.
it isn't an opinion i share. i think Blizzard's CM team do a great job in incredibly difficult circumstances. if i say that my opinion is popular and known then it's still no more fact that yours.
i gather you see yourself as the one to ask "who watches the watchers?" and i think that's an important question to be asking in/of any organisation but the harsh tones of confrontation come across as someone with an axe to grind (to me at least) and hold less weight.
if you have issues with specific acts of moderation the the rules invite you to:
In addition to posting here, you can also email feedback@wowhead.com. While we read your feedback either way, this method is best for questioning moderation policy, discussing personal issues, and other matters better discussed one on one than in public.
if we're taking part in a more generalised discussion then how about we drop the confrontation from the tone and talk about it with mutual respect like adults? as an active user i'm sure they value your opinion but it is only the opinion of one user and they need to cater for many, many more people.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
if we're taking part in a more generalised discussion then how about we drop the confrontation from the tone and talk about it with mutual respect like adults? as an active user i'm sure they value your opinion but it is only the opinion of one user and they need to cater for many, many more people.
I'm having a perfectly civilized argument with Ash, and you jump in and say
how did such a potentially interesting thread get so quickly and so badly derailed by hyper's agenda?
and then have the audacity to saying I'm "not talking alike an adult"?
But otherwise don't bother (with me at least), because I'll be too busy dealing with the issues, not snickering at other people.
I'll be awaiting a response from Ash or someone else.
Post by
asakawa
sometimes you follow an interesting thread and continue to do so even when it becomes boring. the agenda and the fact that you see your rhetoric as "civilized argument" make me uninterested in the direction of the conversation.
all yours i guess.
Post by
hatman555
Blizzard also has some of the worst moderation of any forum. I don't think that's a comparison you want to be making.
I totally agree, but I feel its because they deal with so much more stuff than wowhead does. There mods are more volatile, the act like they want to have fun and talk with the community, but sometimes they snap. When they do, they will lock something down in a very totalitarian way, or even delete connect, black ops style. It has happen a couple of times on wowhead, but for 95% of the situations on these forums the mods are wayyyyyy nicer than the blizzard blues.
If someone posts, for example, that they really like a dungeon... and the first four posts after are "LOL THAT DUNGEON SUCKS" or sarcastic remarks... then a mod should jump in and say "Hey, that dungeon isn't so bad! Remember, guys, try to be a little more constructive."
I think that's one of the worst things a mod could post as mod. When an opinion is stated ("that dungeon isn't so bad") by a mod in a post that is meant to moderate the thread, it comes across as the mod just using his or her position to make their opinion more authoritative.
I don't see that as a negative way to moderate. Its a way of reviving the threat and brining it back to the OP post.
Personally (unrelated to my position as an employee at Wowhead), I would find it really annoying if mods did not have personality. It would also be completely different from how nearly every other website in this industry reacts if they just said the same thing to every thread. Blizzard's mods post like ours for the most part. As we are a site dedicated to a Blizzard product, it makes sense for us to keep the same personality present.
I totally agree with this. And honestly hyper, I don't know what you seem to have so much trouble between moderation and opinion. If you see a moderator saying that something is viable simple to stop the trolling, but it really isn't, then call them out on it. If they say they like a dungeon and its the worst thing in the world, tell them that, and ask them why they think the way they do.
Or maybe if they actually modded correctly, there would be less call for them to actually mod.
If a post is actually breaking the rules, and it is dealt with, and there is follow-up, then people would begin to learn what is in the rules and what isn't, instead of having to hope a certain mod agrees with their opinion and not the other guy's.
Would they learn? Mods have told us repeated times not to fall for Aestu trolling. Every topic he posts gets locked because people like you feel that he should not get away with posting something and you MUST say something or your honor will be diminished. As for everyone else that posts, they wont learn. How many times have we in the paladin forums said "read the stickies" people still post stupid rate my one line paladin post. Its the same with the moderation on these forums.
It is my opinion that the current state of moderation is GOOD and would be diminished if the moderators took a more hardline approach.
Two points that I want to bring up now, that I think will add to this conversation.
First: Colored text is power.
The best example of this is going to a moderators profile and looking at their comments. Lets use
this
as an example. Its not the most in depth comment, Its a good 1 liner that summarizes the situation. +26 votes. Is it a good one line comment? Or is it blue text?
Second: Freedom of confrontation.
So far in this post, you (HSR) have not yielded to a single point. Every time Ash gives you a responce, you always counter it to your side of the argument. Do you really believe that nothing she has posted merits credit of consideration? What are the tone of your posts? Do you ever step back before you post something and read it and think: "How is Ash reading this? Is she rolling her eyes?"
Me personally, I'm reading your posts with a bit of a angry tone. You sound frustrated, which I'm sure you are given some of your points, but you shouldn't let that leak too much into your responses.
The wowhead mods always are open to confrontation of their actions by us. This thread is probably the best example of such. If we followed your standards of moderation, this post wouldn't even exist, and if it did, would have been locked or deleted a long time ago.
Cheers,
Hat
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
I don't see that as a negative way to moderate. Its a way of reviving the threat and brining it back to the OP post.
Because the opinions against the OP were somehow not valid? Either they break rules (in which case they should be "moderated" appropriately) or they don't and they're just opinions that are against the OP, in which case the mod has no reason to do anything
as mod
.
And honestly hyper, I don't know what you seem to have so much trouble between moderation and opinion. If you see a moderator saying that something is viable simple to stop the trolling, but it really isn't, then call them out on it. If they say they like a dungeon and its the worst thing in the world, tell them that, and ask them why they think the way they do.
Where's the line? I was so excited when Ash said they were steamlining the forum rules and were going to try and make them as clear as possible. If that, why not make this clear. When is a mod speaking as a figure of authority and when is he or she not?
So far in this post, you (HSR) have not yielded to a single point. Every time Ash gives you a responce, you always counter it to your side of the argument. Do you really believe that nothing she has posted merits credit of consideration? What are the tone of your posts? Do you ever step back before you post something and read it and think: "How is Ash reading this? Is she rolling her eyes?"
Me personally, I'm reading your posts with a bit of a angry tone. You sound frustrated, which I'm sure you are given some of your points, but you shouldn't let that leak too much into your responses.
Because that's how I argue. I see a conceptual stance and I start walking around it, hammering at it from every angle. If i feel it give way on one spot, I focus on that for a while before moving on. Hopefully once something has been completely examined and tested and found stable we'll have a much better looking conceptual stance.
Before you try to analyze how I debate, why do you look at the debates I actually participate in. This is how I've always done it.
The wowhead mods always are open to confrontation of their actions by us. This thread is probably the best example of such. If we followed your standards of moderation, this post wouldn't even exist, and if it did, would have been locked or deleted a long time ago.
Why? This is a the feedback forum, and we're dealing with an issue directly connected with Wowhead. Why would this thread be locked?
Post by
hatman555
I don't see that as a negative way to moderate. Its a way of reviving the threat and brining it back to the OP post.
Because the opinions against the OP were somehow not valid? Either they break rules (in which case they should be "moderated" appropriately) or they don't and they're just opinions that are against the OP, in which case the mod has no reason to do anything
as mod
.
The Aestu examples are not the best ones we can use. In most of his posts we have gotten so tired of his opinions and ignoring our counter retorts that we get mad at him. The mods come in not because your opinions are invalid, but because others posting in between out posts with negative feelings, and they are just trying to stamp that out. So lets agree, that if a mod wants to do that, they should just say that, and not post any other opinions with it. If on the other hand, the post is valid, but all the replies are trolling, I think its ok for the mod to go 50/50 and say, "hey, stop trolling, and in regards to the OP, I think ponies are pretty too."
And honestly hyper, I don't know what you seem to have so much trouble between moderation and opinion. If you see a moderator saying that something is viable simple to stop the trolling, but it really isn't, then call them out on it. If they say they like a dungeon and its the worst thing in the world, tell them that, and ask them why they think the way they do.
Where's the line? I was so excited when Ash said they were steamlining the forum rules and were going to try and make them as clear as possible. If that, why not make this clear. When is a mod speaking as a figure of authority and when is he or she not?
Go to go with Fayne on this one.
I also agree that they should be able to mark or tag their posts as they see fit, tagging it with a little rocket (like GMs in-game in WoW with the Blizzard symbol) or something like that.
It could be so small and easy for mods to do TEXT. That would place a tiny wowhead rocked on either side of their post. That way you know when its a official moderation, and not just a helpful suggestion. I don't know how the mods would feel about that, but it could be an easy compromise for when they want to be taken more seriously in a threat that might have already had some light-hearted modding.
Before you try to analyze how I debate, why do you look at the debates I actually participate in. This is how I've always done it.
Maybe it would be worth your while to add in some agreement with your debaters, instead of focusing so heavy on your points. It would defiantly change the tone you set in your posts.
The wowhead mods always are open to confrontation of their actions by us. This thread is probably the best example of such. If we followed your standards of moderation, this post wouldn't even exist, and if it did, would have been locked or deleted a long time ago.
Why? This is a the feedback forum, and we're dealing with an issue directly connected with Wowhead. Why would this thread be locked?
Thats the point I'm making, wowhead is very open to this type of debate. I feel like other forums wouldn't let this sort of open questioning against the mods continue.
Going back to the Aestu topic. I have just recently started to come out of my paladin forums shell, and have started posting on more topics. I have always know the damage that Aestu could do, and I'm starting to see how other posters can do the same if left unchecked. If I see a topic or a reply come up, I'm going to flag it within my own post at the top.
HOT TOPIC
This post may be locked if replies do not focus on the original point of the topic.
Post responsibly!
I think posting some like this will be a good reminder to people to not take things too personally and stick to the topic at hand. Most of the good topics that are locked come from trolling and moving away from the topic and more towards the poster that wrote about it.
Cheers,
Hat
Post by
Squishalot
Either they break rules (in which case they should be "moderated" appropriately) or they don't and they're just opinions that are against the OP, in which case the mod has no reason to do anything as mod.
Out of curiosity, are you advocating for a more EJ system where moderators get involved and 'moderate' against every single little infraction? As soon as there is any personal malice in a statement, that poster gets moderated?
One of the things that I personally enjoy about the Wowhead forums is that moderators are willing to let heated debates slide for the most part, and give them chances to resolve themselves. If that means that someone like MoD will come in and point out that you're going to get this thread locked if you don't change direction, then so be it.
In relation to MoD's comments:
a)
"This person actually has a very valid point."
MoD wasn't making an opinion at all in relation to this point. Mousysqueak was essentially acting as a debate moderator (as opposed to a forum 'moderator') and attempting to drag the discussion away from a thread lock. MoD wasn't making any opinion on whether Aestu is right or wrong, he was was simply reinforcing the debate shouldn't be about Aestu himself, as evidenced by:
b)
"Folks, stay on topic please. You don't have to like Aestu, but that doesn't mean you should turn this thread into a discussion about him rather than the one he started. =/"
The problem was that you, Adamsm and others were derailing the thread away from a discussion one, into an Aestu-bashing one. As a mod, MoD had two options - attempt to re-rail the thread (that never really made it onto the rails in the first place, by virtue of the OP being named Aestu), or to lock the thread. If it hadn't been for all the narky comments by Adamsm, and derailing comments by you and Sinespe, MoD would never have had to get involved.
Considering that the thread then continued on with on-topic discussion for the next 7 pages or so following MoD's comment, I can only agree with Gnub's final comment:
Sigh.
This debate had so much potential, but has degraded into the "usual namecalling" (again?), which at this point seems impossible to recover from. And no, it's
far
from only being caused by a single individual.
Post by
Ashelia
Out of curiosity, are you advocating for a more EJ system where moderators get involved and 'moderate' against every single little infraction? As soon as there is any personal malice in a statement, that poster gets moderated?
I love EJ, I have always loved it, but that moderation system is very far from an environment most people actively enjoy. It's intense--and that fits EJ perfectly, as EJ is a brilliant theorycrafting forum, but it does not fit Wowhead which is far more inclusive as it's a widespread database for all types of WoW players. If we ran an EJ system, Aetsu would have been banned within a week of joining and no one would ever be able to talk in our feedback forum openly about us. 50-60% of our existing posts would have been deleted/locked and many prominent members would've also been banned along with Aetsu types.
So to HSR, if you do want that kind of hypervigiliant policy, you should realize to some extent the grass is always greener. Every system has its own set of problems.
Where's the line? I was so excited when Ash said they were steamlining the forum rules and were going to try and make them as clear as possible. If that, why not make this clear. When is a mod speaking as a figure of authority and when is he or she not?
I feel like the rules are pretty clear. I did redo them and it's more obvious to see what type of content we want, why things will get locked, and so on. There had not been a problem brought up with moderator's content (nothing in feedback, nothing here) so it was not addressed. It's unfair to use this as an example as it wasn't an issue when I wrote the rules, at the time you were upset that they had deleted some posts and that the Recycle Bin wasn't moderated consistently--not that they expressed a personal belief.
Because that's how I argue. I see a conceptual stance and I start walking around it, hammering at it from every angle. If i feel it give way on one spot, I focus on that for a while before moving on. Hopefully once something has been completely examined and tested and found stable we'll have a much better looking conceptual stance.
I do not feel like we will ever reach a compromise unless I give in to you--which is not something I feel is right to do. It's great to argue so passionately and in-depth, but you give me the impression that you don't want to find a common ground after how long we've talked about this. I'm not sure this should have been approached like a debate in this manner. Perhaps it's my fault for engaging, I didn't realize it would be this thorough and unrelenting.
For example, it feels like you want me to never post again and the same with the mods. That goes against everything I've seen in community management, both as a gamer and someone who has worked in the gaming industry for going on four years now. I'm willing to admit sometimes there can be foot in mouth issues with this, but that's what apologies are for. And, I mean, where do you draw the line? I should only answer feedback? Post my news post and shut up? Is that the type of forum you want, the modding experience you desire?
Maybe it is. But is it the type of moderation experience most users desire? In this thread people have said no. I've gotten some emails about how people enjoy the CM approach. Malgayne also used to post a lot. Miyari posted a lot for a few years. I can go to a myraid of forums, I can talk to my friends who work in the industry, and they'll all say they think forum moderators should mingle and should talk. They should try not to take offensive stances, but if someone is posting about a dungeon or an idea, they should say it rocks if they like it. They should say no if it seems a little absurd, in a nice way. They should help generate and excite the community.
It could be so small and easy for mods to do TEXT. That would place a tiny wowhead rocked on either side of their post. That way you know when its a official moderation, and not just a helpful suggestion. I don't know how the mods would feel about that, but it could be an easy compromise for when they want to be taken more seriously in a threat that might have already had some light-hearted modding.
We can do this, but the thing is, a mod will still be respected. What's to stop someone from in 1-2 months saying that mods still should not post at all about personal beliefs because even if they don't have green (or blue or pink) text, everyone knows they're a mod/employee, so everyone still sucks up to them?
I'm not convinced that won't happen, after what I've seen here, and I won't ask for developer time unless the most vocal can agree to a compromise. If someone says this fixes it (e.g., the people who have said mods should never post a personal thing), then sure, we can ask for 10 minutes of dev time for this feature. But if it doesn't... then that's effort better spend elsewhere.(##RESPBREAK##)2##DELIM##Ashelia##DELIM##
Post by
Gnub
Bit of a added comment here, but we do have ways of posting in a clear "now I'm a moderator way", by adding an edit (like I just did with this post. However, sometimes it's not always possible to have the black/white approach, as sometimes - the post is both. It's simply inevitable, unless you'd want to split it into two posts, which would look... strange, to say the least.
Still, I tend to believe that my posts usually give a clear indication of what my purpose was to reply in the first place. Granted, there are some examples in the past, where this did not apply - we're always learning. :)(##RESPBREAK##)8##DELIM##Gnub##DELIM##So, I heard you liked moderation, so I put some moderation in a post about moderation, so you can moderate moderators while you moderate.
Post by
hatman555
It could be so small and easy for mods to do TEXT. That would place a tiny wowhead rocked on either side of their post. That way you know when its a official moderation, and not just a helpful suggestion. I don't know how the mods would feel about that, but it could be an easy compromise for when they want to be taken more seriously in a threat that might have already had some light-hearted modding.
We can do this, but the thing is, a mod will still be respected. What's to stop someone from in 1-2 months saying that mods still should not post at all about personal beliefs because even if they don't have green (or blue or pink) text, everyone knows they're a mod/employee, so everyone still sucks up to them?
I'm not convinced that won't happen, after what I've seen here, and I won't ask for developer time unless the most vocal can agree to a compromise. If someone says this fixes it (e.g., the people who have said mods should never post a personal thing), then sure, we can ask for 10 minutes of dev time for this feature. But if it doesn't... then that's effort better spend elsewhere.
My suggestion was based off of what Fayne suggested, and I thought listing it would be a pretty good idea for a compromise.
I have 0 problems with the way Wowhead is moderated. In fact, I wish the mods would post MORE! There is always an intonation in a post, and its quiet clear when a moderator is telling you a joke, and telling you when you have stepped over the line.
Should the "modhead" tag be something to look into? I don't really think so. Is it an option? Sure. I would just stick with what we have, and encourage the frequent visitors, the people who are reading every line in this post, to make an effort to post a bit more relaxed.
Cheers,
Hat
Still, I tend to believe that my posts usually give a clear indication of what my purpose was to reply in the first place.
Huh? ;-)(##RESPBREAK##)8##DELIM##Gnub##DELIM##I see what you did there! :P
Post by
asakawa
i agree with what Hat is saying here.
i was interested to hear how moderators approached posting in the forum when all their text is green and Gnub answered that query quite well.
it's worth mentioning that the only time i've ever been annoyed at an act of moderation was an occasion when the moderator didn't edit a comment or enforce a rule but just commented in the way Hyper brought up. the fact that i was annoyed by this at the time doesn't mean that i was right to be so or that the moderator wasn't right to make the comment they did. once hindsight kicked in i saw that the moderator was right and while i wasn't breaking rules i was acting counter to the way Wowhead wants their forums to run.
my point being that perhaps those times when a moderator acts before rules have actually been broken are the times that cause the most friction but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be done.
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