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Do we get our money's worth from WoW?
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Post by
606231
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Post by
93865
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Post by
93865
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Post by
Adamsm
What the hell does anything that Aestu is saying have to do with the fact that Lokibrth doesn't want to give up 15 bucks a month to play a game? I mean really...it's still simple; you don't like what Blizzard is doing, stop playing the game, problem solved. It's still just that simple, no one is forcing you to give Blizzard your money.
And Aestu, you do realize that HSR is playing you right? He's enjoying watching you rant and rave, and chuckling about it.
Post by
93865
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Post by
Adamsm
Hyperspacebel? I have no illusions about what sort of person he is or why he posts. I don't think he's chuckling, I think it's more accurate to say he's gritting his teeth. Small and pathetic individuals who post on forums to maintain a pretense of superiority are deeply hurt when this is denied them. As it happens, though, I really don't care what he thinks or how he feels - although I think I do have a pretty good idea. I enjoy writing for its own sake, and don't particularly care if one individual can't participate in meaningful discussions because of his flaws of intellect or character. This is a forum not a dialogue, and the audience is obviously far wider than the individual to whom a particular post responds.
Writing an individual forum or blog post is unlikely to cause anyone to have an epiphany, but over time, attitudes shift, opinions change, and the world can move forward.
Aestu....that post right there? Nothing but pure irony; that's exactly how you post and act on these forums. And yes, HSR is laughing at you; he's having nothing but fun winding you up and making you act stupid.
Post by
367590
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Post by
44284
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Post by
Hyperspacerebel
It was fine going off topic when I was talking to the OP, but if you want to discuss economics, Aestu, make a thread in Randomness. We've already has several over the last year, so you could bump one of those threads too.
One thing I'll mention with regards to your post, if you seriously believe that the Great Depression was caused by one factor, you definitely have done no research and are just spouting something you heard in passing.
Also, you should come to randomness more, we really do laugh out asses off about you there.
Post by
367590
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Post by
tuckmuck203
Sorry, but I have to agree with the last quote of paladingod's.
However, paladingod, people are human, and do illogical things a lot of the time. Ideally, if you couldn't pay for WoW without giving up food or water or shelter, you'd stop playing WoW. That doesn't always happen. Go read Mark Twain's On the Damned Human Race.
Also, I'd just like to add that everyone saying stop QQing and quit if you don't want to pay $15 a month...Read the actual thread guys. The OP wasn't saying he didn't want to pay it, he was saying that if you consider how much money blizzard is making, then we should be getting more "bang for our buck" if you'll pardon the expression.
Blizzard can obviously get away with how they are doing things right now, but they have the means and the opportunity to go above and beyond expectations.
Post by
Azrile
Your entire argument that WOW is exploiting us is looking at the top line, and like a kid, crying because someone is making a lot of money. The fact is that if you look at the individual consumers, they are not exploited.
1. There are many other places to spend our entertainment dollars, not just MMORPG. It is impossible for a monopoly to exist in such a small segment of an industry when direct competition can come from many other business types.
2. Direct competitors of WOW like AOC and Warhammer charge exactly the same price for far inferior products. Last time I checked, one of the main reasons monopolies were bad is because they overcharged for inferior products.
3. The $/hour cost of WOW is absurdly low. I probably play 80 hours per month, which comes out to less than 20 cents per hour. How does that compare to going to a movie?
A monopoly is defined by the effects on the consumer. WOW offers a better game for the same cost as it's direct competitors. It offers a much cheaper $/hour cost than sector competitors like music and movies AND finally, a monopoly can never exist for a product that is 100% optional. We aren't talking building materials, electricity or Operating systems.. We are talking about a rather obscure form of entertainment.
Nice try, but really, you sound like the loser guy from Good Will Hunting who tried to use freshman economics to impress people. Because a company makes a successful product does not automatically mean they have to waste all the profits improving the product in marginal ways.
How do you like those apples?
Post by
44284
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Post by
Azrile
Uh, no, there won't be a revolution. Getting a job would be less of an effort.
You're being silly.
It's happened in the past, and it is one of the flaws of unchecked capitalism, but as i said:
On a less extreme note. The problem is clearly not solved. Our economy is still in the process of recovering from a massive blow because of stupid consumerism. Letting people spend stupidly, is not safe for the rest of us.
"So you impose regulations on companies. You make them charge less, and you simply make them retain their workforce. You do it equally across the board so no company gets anedge and then there's no problem."
You are really ignorant regarding history. In the past few years, there was a hic-up in the world economy, which in 5 years will be mostly forgotten.
Your whole 'impose regulations' is exactly what communism is. Price control, employee controls.. How did that work out for the USSR? (do people even know those initials anymore). Communism collapse completely by doing what you are suggesting.
Finally, who in their right mind would ever start a business if there is no upside. " gee, if you are too successful, the gov't is going to move in and limit your profits and force you to keep employees. and oh yeah, those employees will know that no matter what they do, the gov't will not let you be fired.".
Who is going to risk investing a 100M on a game (that is how much the new Bioware MMORPG cost to make) if there is no upside. If your chance for profits are severely limited, but your risk for losing all that money is very real ( AOC lost 25M).
You are talking very VERY basic economics here. This is HS level stuff that has already been proven... just look at the USA and the USSR. One accounts for 30% of the world's total GDP, the other doesn't exist.
Post by
Azazel
If I didn't get my money's worth from WoW, I wouldn't play it. Simple as that.
Post by
93865
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Post by
mindthegap5
no
Post by
Monday
Hyperspacebel? I have no illusions about what sort of person he is or why he posts. I don't think he's chuckling, I think it's more accurate to say he's gritting his teeth. Small and pathetic individuals who post on forums to maintain a pretense of superiority are deeply hurt when this is denied them. As it happens, though, I really don't care what he thinks or how he feels - although I think I do have a pretty good idea. I enjoy writing for its own sake, and don't particularly care if one individual can't participate in meaningful discussions because of his flaws of intellect or character. This is a forum not a dialogue, and the audience is obviously far wider than the individual to whom a particular post responds.
Writing an individual forum or blog post is unlikely to cause anyone to have an epiphany, but over time, attitudes shift, opinions change, and the world can move forward.
Aestu....that post right there? Nothing but pure irony; that's exactly how you post and act on these forums. And yes, HSR is laughing at you; he's having nothing but fun winding you up and making you act stupid.
Pretty much this.
HSR likes to make other people mad, without actually becoming mad. He'll work you until you turn red and fume, and he'll be chuckling the entire time.
He's like my role model =P
Post by
Tya1
Ok. I think that I get your problem. Your problem is not that you have to spend that 15 dollars, but that you think you could also spend 15-x dollars instead for the same content.
The problem is: your 2900% mark up is totally grabbed out of thin air.
Of those 15 dollars Blizzard doesn't just pay a GM, server and some designer developing wow stuff....they pay everything. For every x people joining the game, they need x CM's, x GM's, x servers etc. Ideally this could grow endlessly, but Blizzard has to deal with logistics as well. Where do you place those people? They need a desk, computer, chair, space to actually breath.
At one moment you can conclude the building they are in is becoming too small, and they need to start investing in additional space.
More servers is more maintenance, is more people. More people means more salaries. And while you might look at it: person x earns y per month, I can tell you, the company pays a little more for that. I don't know how things are in America, but where I come from a company easily pays an additional 30 to 50% of the persons salary to the government. Somebody who earns 60k, costing 90k. Bonuses etc, which is not uncommon in gaming business, don't forget those.
Everything Blizzard owns, from a simple printer, to the servers and building, needs to written off, and replaced every x years, to ensure that the company can keep excisting without issues.
Also, you DO get new content. Patches. Expansions. For your 15 dollar per month you are getting a whole revamped world to keep things interesting, and about 4000 new quests in about 5 weeks.
Lastly: you don't pay to world of warcraft. You are paying Blizzard Activision. Where do you think they are paying StarCraft 2 from? Diablo3? You think that every employee puts 5 dollars in a jar each month to ensure new stuff is being developed?
When Blizzard brought wow on the game they expected x people to join the game, and they would need y goods to ensure that the game would perform good + z costs to earn back + x% mark up because companies make profit. That is why companies excist. They believe in their product and hope that others are willing to pay them for it, so that they can continue doing that.
Based on that they came with a price of 15 dollars a month.
Now, the game has been highly succesful. So succesful that they are setting a standard to the market. YOU the player has decided that other games are not as good as Blizzard, so they ended up not making the same growth.
Blizzard is making plenty profit on it. That is their reward for being succesful. But your claim that it's 14,50 per month, per player is total nonsense.
And to add to that: if Blizzard really was after 'milking' the player, they would have introduced price increases every year. Inflation also hits Blizzard. But instead, as far as I know, I am already paying the same price for the last 5 years.
On a side note: I know little of American economics, from my perspective I think that it could do with a little more regulation, certainly considering what has happened the last few years. That said, nobody is free from blame here when it comes to the last developments in economics.
We (and I talk here about the people in my age group, say 25 to 35), have never learned how it is to deal with bad times. We have grown up in a time of prosperity and lived accordingly to that. If we wanted that new telephone, tv or clothes we would buy it, with or without the help of our parents. We never learned to budget, to be careful, plan ahead. Now we pay for that.
But, while a government is responsible for making sure a countries economics is sufficient to supply a good living standard (by having costs of living equals more or less the average income), it's still the responsibity of the consumer to make sure he or she is dealing with his money in a good fashion.
I would suggest looking at Maslows pyramid and I would say that every beyond the need of safety and security is a luxery in the end, which is something you can live without off. Wow is so far replaced from this (self-development) that is silly to demand Blizzard changes his price because it's 'too expensive for what you get'.
*sorry for all the x, y and z's to replace numbers. But I didn't want to be accused of making my own numbers up, so there you go.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
One thing I'll mention with regards to your post, if you seriously believe that the Great Depression was caused by one factor, you definitely have done no
research
...
What's yours?
That's an awkwardly constructed response. What's my research? Research is more of a
how
than a
what
. The sources which I research are a
what
, and the conclusions I draw from the research also.
I could enumerate at least a dozen causes of the Great Depression, but as I said, if that's something you want to discuss, go make a thread about it.
On a related note, I just discovered that
innumerate
is my new favorite word
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