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The Easter spirit - bringing discussion back into Randomness.
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Post by
Hyperspacerebel
We don't need Mary to do it for us.
I'll say it again. Show me anywhere where I or the Church says that we do need her.
Stop attacking strawmen.
Post by
149406
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Squishalot
If God is omniscient, then doesn't he already know your future? He knows what choices you will make with your free will and can work with said choices.
I know where you're coming from, and I still see that as an issue with the free will concept. I personally see the idea that he knows my future as the idea that we don't have free will, because we are unable to choose a path that hasn't been laid out in our future.
As I understand it, 'free will' from the Christian perspective is the ability to consciously choose. That our choices are known with 100% accuracy doesn't take away from it (from a deterministic perspective, this is also reasonable - our choices are the net result of historical events, and 100% predictable with sufficient processing), and I respect that view, even though I disagree that it means that we are anything more than Sims in God's computer game.
However, the act of 'hardening the hearts of the Egyptians' implies an action by God that goes beyond simply 'knowing' the future, he's influencing it. He's not supposed to 'work with said choices', he's supposed to 'let us make said choices'. There's a very big fundamental difference.
You're still the only person to make any claim about it being necessary, so unless you're making an argument against yourself, it's still a strawman.
MyTie also questioned where it talks about celebrating Christmas in the Bible.
I'm positing that Christmas isn't a necessary celebration (as far as a special Mass is concerned), in the same way that birthday party attendance isn't necessary. You're saying that it is. I'm questioning why.
As for me being the only person to make any claims, this whole thread is only here because I made a few claims for discussion. This is one of them.
You continue to judge from your standpoint. From your standpoint yes maybe they are "opinions." From mine they're revealed truths.
That, in itself, is an opinion. It is your opinion that they are truths. It will continue to remain an opinion until you can demonstrate it to be otherwise without relying on the logically fallacious, circular argument that is reliance on the Bible.
Asking something of Mary is not the same as asking her to do it herself. It's just an entrusting of the matter to her. She is the closest human to Christ, there is no reason not to ask the Saint to intercede with her as while.
You're asking the Saint to intercede with God and Mary, implying that you want God and Mary to do something about it. The reason not to ask the Saint to intercede with her is because that borders on idolation. Again, even if you yourself are not doing any more than entrusting the matter to her, you should be able to see how people can interpret that phrase to suggest that Mary will also have the power to do something about it.
Post by
john26922
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