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General Lore Discussions
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Post by
Morec0
Random question, by any chance has anyone here read
Snow Fight
? I've heard it deviated greatly from the lore and I've always wondered in what way, haha.
Well, just looking at the cover I can already tell you that, at the time all three of those character met, Thrall was NOT wearing that dress.
He was wearing a purple one.
Post by
Morec0
It's not a new idea at all, but what Blizz should have done with the whole "There must always be a Lich King" thing is sort of tweaked the idea into "There will always be a Lich King".
After all, Arthas was the
Lich
King. What do Liches do? Come back after you kill them.
So what SHOULD have happened was the idea that unless someone else were to take Arthas' place as the Lich King, he would simply regain his power and rise again to pose a threat - with the subtext of "eventually any prison he is kept in will crumble around him, and this will all begin again" - so someone with enough strength of will would have to step in while he was still weak from defeat and steal the mantle from him to ensure a lasting defeat of the Scourge.
Of course they could still have pulled the "there was enough of Arthas/Ner'zhul within the Frozen Throne to turn Bolvar to evil" later and with just as much ease, but this would have gotten rid of the biggest plot hole "Didn't we just kill ALL of the Scourge's strongest guys?"
Post by
morginar
After all, Arthas was the Lich King.
Ner'zhul. Ner'zhul is the one and only lich king, Arthas is a over hyped pawn!
I'm still convinced that Ner'zhul just tricked the paladin using the ghost of that king to get a new host.
Post by
Atik
After all, Arthas was the Lich King.
Ner'zhul. Ner'zhul is the one and only lich king, Arthas is a over hyped pawn!
I'm still convinced that Ner'zhul just tricked the paladin using the ghost of that king to get a new host.
I prefer the theory that Yogg'Saron was behind it all. Considering the fact that he and Arthas' father share the line of "No king rules forever."
Post by
Stabhorn
After all, Arthas was the Lich King.
Ner'zhul. Ner'zhul is the one and only lich king, Arthas is a over hyped pawn!
I'm still convinced that Ner'zhul just tricked the paladin using the ghost of that king to get a new host.
I prefer the theory that Yogg'Saron was behind it all. Considering the fact that he and Arthas' father share the line of "No king rules forever."
To that point; did we ever see the Scourge fighting the Iron Dwarves?
Post by
Adamsm
We didn't, but it probably happened on the edge of Storm Peaks and Icecrown. I don't think Yoggy had anything to do with Arthas beyond laughing as the Saronite corruption drove people mad....and we did see the Scourge hold a Faceless captive in the mine in Icecrown.
Post by
Atik
We did? Was that a quest I missed, or just a random flavor thing?
Post by
Morec0
We did? Was that a quest I missed, or just a random flavor thing?
There's a saronite mine in the center mountain of the glacier. You go in to free slave miners, I believe, and you get a quest from the Faceless One to help free it.
Post by
Adamsm
We did? Was that a quest I missed, or just a random flavor thing?
There's a saronite mine in the center mountain of the glacier. You go in to free slave miners, I believe, and you get a quest from the Faceless One to help free it.
Yup; quest is from the Argent Crusade guy on the ships and you kill a Vrykul to get the key to free the Faceless one.
Post by
Atik
Huh.
Yeah, I never did it. Or I might have done it the one time I cleared Icecrown, but was totally on autopilot.
Still doesn't really discredit the "Yogg was manipulating things" theory. Its not like he would care that much about one faceless one.
Post by
355559
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Atik
Well excuse me for calling out the abomination who went and ate all my blue cheese.
This even after I explained to him that blue cheese isn't actually blue.
Post by
Adamsm
He wouldn't, but the question was asked if there was a fight between Yogg's forces and The Scourge...of course, that's leaving out the whole thing from Warcraft 3 where during the rush to reach the Throne(aka
The Forgotten Ones
), Anub and Arthas tear apart what we now know were Old God minions.
Post by
oneforthemoney
They said there was a rivalry, but it was never explored in game, as the Scourge seemed quite able to mine and even forge Saronite without ill effects. I think the undead might bridge the divide between flesh creatures, which the old gods are able to directly corrupt, and Titan constructs which they have been able to manipulate.
Post by
Adamsm
Or alternatively, due to the necromancy coming directly from the Dreadlords and the Legion, they may not be able to affect them at all since there is already a corruption in place.
Post by
Morec0
Or alternatively, due to the necromancy coming directly from the Dreadlords and the Legion, they may not be able to affect them at all since there is already a corruption in place.
Could also simply be because they were mindless creature, puppetted by necromancers and the like from afar, the Old Gods simply weren't able to assert mental dominance over them.
Post by
Stabhorn
Or alternatively, due to the necromancy coming directly from the Dreadlords and the Legion, they may not be able to affect them at all since there is already a corruption in place.
Could also simply be because they were mindless creature, puppetted by necromancers and the like from afar, the Old Gods simply weren't able to assert mental dominance over them.
That's an interesting thought.
Post by
Atik
Or alternatively, due to the necromancy coming directly from the Dreadlords and the Legion, they may not be able to affect them at all since there is already a corruption in place.
Could also simply be because they were mindless creature, puppetted by necromancers and the like from afar, the Old Gods simply weren't able to assert mental dominance over them.
That's always how I interpreted it.
The Old Gods have to go after the necromancer, as the undead they control are merely puppets.
After all, there are Forsaken within the Twilight Cultists. Some of them could very likely be suffering from the madness.
Post by
Stabhorn
Or alternatively, due to the necromancy coming directly from the Dreadlords and the Legion, they may not be able to affect them at all since there is already a corruption in place.
Could also simply be because they were mindless creature, puppetted by necromancers and the like from afar, the Old Gods simply weren't able to assert mental dominance over them.
That's always how I interpreted it.
The Old Gods have to go after the necromancer, as the undead they control are merely puppets.
After all, there are Forsaken within the Twilight Cultists. Some of them could very likely be suffering from the madness.
Although, if Yogg-Saron can turn non-sentient
fungi
into monsters, I think he could be able to control a few undead.
On another note, since I'm randomly skimming lore, according to Volazj's dungeon journal, " Roused by this disturbance, the entity has sent one of its most ancient warriors - Herald Volazj - to cull the beleaguered nerubians and annihilate anyone foolish enough to threaten the Old God." Yogg-Saron was careful to cull the nerubians with his personal servants, yet he did not take similar precautions with the Horde and Alliance.
Post by
Adamsm
Or alternatively, due to the necromancy coming directly from the Dreadlords and the Legion, they may not be able to affect them at all since there is already a corruption in place.
Could also simply be because they were mindless creature, puppetted by necromancers and the like from afar, the Old Gods simply weren't able to assert mental dominance over them.
That's always how I interpreted it.
The Old Gods have to go after the necromancer, as the undead they control are merely puppets.
After all, there are Forsaken within the Twilight Cultists. Some of them could very likely be suffering from the madness.
Of course they are suffering from madness...they are serving the Twilight Hammer/Cult. That just shows that there are world enders in all of the races; you see Tauren among their rank too after all. Even among the Scourge there are those who have their minds but believe fully in what the Scourge will do; KT was one of them. I honestly think there is such a difference between the Old God power and necromancy that one would shield a being from the other......which may or may not be proven by the fact that the Nerubians were resilient to the undead plague but could still have the corpses raised up, since the Nerubians came from the Aqir which were the servants of the Old Ones way way way back in the beginning.
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