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Returning Hunter, PvP build (SV)
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Post by
skribs
I'm making a character on a new realm, mainly for 3's with my buddy and his roommate (DK and Paladin combo for 2's, with my addition for patch 3.2 when 2's doesnt matter). I haven't paid much attention to hunter PvP builds in the past, and I'm a bit out-of-date on hunter info (tried to catch up recently) but I think I got a good grasp. Anyway, on to my build:
0/20/51
. I skimmed the sticky, looked up a lot of stuff separately, and this is what I come up with. It's partially based on changes coming in 3.2, because I'm not sure if I'll be 80 before then anyway, but here's why I did/didn't pick specific talents in SV:
Imp Tracking (last 2) - I'd probably use Track Hidden a lot, which doesn't benefit.
Entrapment - In my group, I'd probably use mostly Frost Arrow and Black Arrow, with Snake Trap being 3rd on my list. Neither are affected by Entrapment.
Trap Mastery - Frost Arrow will not last longer
in PvP
with this talent (unless I'm wrong on how PvP CC works), and the bonus damage to Black Arrow doesn't seem worth it for the talent points spent.
Lightning Reflexes + Expose Weakness: Lots of extra agility and AP, right? Well, I took the numbers from the Furious Gear (assuming fairly equal ratio with lesser gear) and 8 points for LR+EW gives approximately the same stats as 2 points in Hunter vs. Wild or 3 points in Careful Aim. In comparison, really not worth it (the talents were mainly designed for the BC SV raider, who would stack agility for the EW debuff, and are a lot less powerful now that its a self-buff and gear has a better mix of stats).
Anyway, I just wanted to see what other hunters out there thought about this. I haven't done much with an 80 hunter (was my main class in Vanilla and part of BC, but I never did end-game content with one), but I was very good at PvP in the 29 bracket on my last hunter despite being very undergeared (948HP as opposed to twinks with 2.5k+), so I think I got a little bit going for me.
Post by
416223
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
skribs
Ah, right. I was going to use that glyph but lost it in the mix (was checking them all out first) and forgot about it. It was real annoying, too, because the ad on the site is in front of the popup menu for the glyphs, making it hard to read some of them, so I just got through it quick. My hunter isn't even made yet - I can't get on my account atm (of course I encounter problems on Saturday, when they don't answer tickets until Monday), so I'm focusing on forums atm.
Post by
Rullis
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#cVbRztxRfuhjox0eVdohz
if u wanna go with the pro (catlike reflexes will be buffed so )
Post by
416223
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
skribs
Hey, hey, BM is great...for levelling. Man I remember levelling in TBC - I'd be top of the damage meter, my pet would be second, when doing an instance.
Post by
249472
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
skribs
I appreciate the big, long post. If you think that's big, check out the old DK PvP thread I made (back in 3.0, but its still linked in the 'helpful threads sticky'). Like I said in my above post, though, chances are I won't be getting much agility from enchants/gems, and there are several other talents which give an increase in stats that result in much more per point. And its not like I'm not picking up Survivalist to lead to Hunter vs. Wild anyway.
Just because the top do it, doesn't mean I have to either. Top-rated probably have a lot of experience, and back in the day LR+EW was a staple of survival. I don't think that's true anymore, unless you're optomizing for DPS. While spec and stats are important - skill is more important. I remember with a levelling spec and only 948 HP I owned it up in the 29 bracket (twinks had 2.5k+), not because of my gear, but because of my skill. Similar effects could be happening to the top-rated hunters.
I could be wrong, but I like to think I'm not on this one.
Actually, I don't really like focused aim - IMO hit is better to get from gear than from talents, as its less item value (meaning easier to get on gear AND less item value per talent when compared to crit talents), but I thought the steady shot part might help. If it's only for the hit, I'll drop those 3 and go with something else - except I need at least one point in one of these tiers to keep imp stings.
I put on noxious stings mainly for the dispel mechanic, not for the serpent sting mechanic. Same reason I kept up Imp Stings - not for damage, but for added utility. I'll probably be the primary source of CC in my group, and I'll have the only mana drain. The reason I kept 3/3 in Hunting Party is because chances are I'll be doing things other than attacking a lot (e.g. CC or kiting), especially because I'm utility in this group - and with resilience I can't garuntee too many crits. So I do have reason to grab those three, especially with how easy it is to have poison dispel if a healer is involved.
Problem is, I can't really move too much around at this point. I need at least 1 point in Focused Aim to keep my stings, so overall I'm looking at a fairly similar build either way. Once I get my hunter levelled to 80 and get a decent PvP set, I'll look back at my stats, but for now I have to say I'm liking the build I have. If I did change anything, it would probably be to drop the 6 from marks (bottom 3 and focused aim) and go for some health in BM.
Post by
249472
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Rullis
I
really
hope that that's a joke Rullis. BM died quite a while ago. Go check the patch notes from a few months ago.
EDIT: After looking at your armory, I'm guessing it was a joke. Tell me I'm right.
You'are right,hohoho
Post by
skribs
Lol I didn't mean for you to read it now to learn it, I just meant look how long it is ("my thread is bigger than your thread"). I was trying to be a jerk, and there you go and say "found it most enlightening." You ruined the joke.
In all seriousness, I think having the dispel mechanic in does give me some advantage, but I'll try it your way at first (I'm trusting your experience).
0/14/57
, how's this, do you think? Like I said, it's more designed for 3.2 (because that will probably be out before I'm doing hardcore PvP), where I can pop black+frost arrow and get some benefit out of trap mastery there. If I'm not really using steady shot, black arrow will probably be one of my higher damage attacks (well behind explosive shot, but up there none the less).
Post by
249472
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
sabaw
Edited for second build:
I say surefooted is an incredibly MEH talent. Not worth it with its current effects (would be if it had a 5,10,15% movement bonus). 30% shorter duration sounds great and all but 1. Alot of snares are incredibly easy to refresh/reapply (hamstring, coi, crippling poison, slow) and basically even being in a snare long enough to realize the potential of the 3 talent points you just spent is a bad thing, if youre in melee for 7 seconds vs 10, it wont matter. If youre snared/stuck, you use MC, a trinket, scatter+wing, wyvern or disengage.
Entrapment is definitely worth it. There will be times, in fact alot of times, where you will want to drop a frost instead of freezing and it helps alot. With 3.2, youll even get 2 chances to entrap because of frost+snake. Between entrapement and trap mastery, ill go with entrapment
Personally id put points in point of no escape, 6% crit when you use something that youll almost always want to be using on CD is not bad. But its personal preference imo and can be skipped.
Make sure you have some hit gear. Deadly+Furious ring will get you some hit from the deadly. Some top hunters get the to hit neck and cloaks. You dont want to miss on that cruical scatter or wyvern.
If youre not using 2 hand weapons (or using 2 hand weapons but no weapon chain) then try to find points for deflection, you dont want to be disarmed by rogues for 10 whole seconds. 10 seconds of doing nothing/not being able to use deterrence = bad.
Get rid of wyvern sting glyph, its a shadow of itself and 6 seconds wont be worth it. Top hunters tend to use aimed shot. Aimed shot allows for more damage from the shorter cooldown and more importatnly, gives a more reliable mortal shot effect from you - be it from lag, gcd, reaction time or whatever, you now have a window to allow yourself a 100% uptime of the MS effect on the opponent.
Post by
138722
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
skribs
Surefooted isn't going anywhere. If I get slowed in any way, I want it to be over quick. Yeah, I have tools to get away already, but that 3 second window could mean the difference between him catching up after and reapplying or him not getting to me. I'm keeping Thrill of the Hunt, but I didn't think about group comp - with a ret pally, I don't need Hunting Party.
When I said I wasn't going for Trap Mastery at first, its because the traps I was thinking of wouldn't benefit enough from it. Although if I do switch over to Entrapment, I guess I could see how Trap Mastery and Point of no Escape is worth it. By the way: If you are relying on frost trap, POTN isn't preference - it should be mandatory. If you are not planning on using it, it's meh. So it's preference based on which trap you use, not after you decide to use it.
Now I'm thinking something like
0/14/57
, although if I still find that mana isn't an issue I'll swap over the 3 points from Thrill of the Hunt to Expose Weakness.
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